Great time now to buy a Mac Pro

[Dan Worley]

I think the new mac pro so revolutionary that I do not know why anyone would NOT buy it and stay stuck in the past with the current Mac Pros. I know, it’s all about ..money..money..money..

But I will say this:
One MUST realize when the is a MAJOR leap forward and recognize it as such.
The new mac Pro is not some “upgrade”, it is a new future and buying backwards at this point in time must be looked at in that light.
The 1000 you save could be a very expensive 1000 indeed. Of course, waiting for the 2nd generation of the new Mac Pro might make some sort of sense..let them iron out bugs, add the final “new” features...but buying backwards?....not for me bubba...

Thank you, future boy.

The problem i'd have with buying the new MacPro besides the cost and all of the associated 1st run components you'll need is it's a 1st generation product!
Who really knows what Apple will change between the 1st year release and the 2nd year update?
After seeing the limitations users had with the early of Intel MacPro re:64bit, myself I feel more comfortable getting a late version (2010-2012) and waiting until the new MacPro gets revised once or twice and the cost of the associated peripherals comes down a bit.
Typically Apple makes major revisions to 1st generation products,I don't want to be an early adopter victim,1st generation,not me.

That's exactly where I'm at.

[Dan Worley]

Point taken 2hip, but the nMP, although revolutionary (literally) in certain aspects of its design, provides only incremental performance enhancements and forces the user to either abandon PCIe or opt for expensive expansion chassis. Thunderbolt promises nothing that isn't already available via PCIe. USB3 is a $20 PCIe card add-on for current MP owners.

But, if money isn't an object "buy" all means, get yourself a nMP when they hit. Maybe some audio software will start to leverage those dual GPUs before too long. Maybe.

For those still making do with first or second gen MPs (1,1 and 2,1), you may find a move to a 4,1 or 5,1 with ample RAM and an SSD gives you shockingly upgraded performance, more than enough to keep you happy for years to come, and at a very modest price. I continue to recommend 4,1 or 5,1 for those buying used as the 4,1 can be upgraded to 5,1 with a simple EFI flash and the 5,1 is the most likely to be supported under Mac OS for a number of years. Also, memory is cheaper for the 4,1 and 5,1 than for the 3,1 MPs. You can add a new GPU (or any other PCIe expansion you desire) at anytime.

Great advice. Thank you!!! I expect five to seven years out of a 4,1 or 5,1. My 1,1, has giving me almost eight.

[toodamnhip]

I agree that the 1st generation is best left alone. I would add that time will tell how companies start to really address thunderbolt and these new macs. You'll see in about a year is my guess. So in a year, when 2nd gen comes out and companies start making thunderbolt connectors that make us all drool, let's see how them old 5,1 Macs look. It will be interesting to watch. An only "incremental" power improvement in this new Mac??? What? It is my understanding that it is basically twice as fast.

[James Steele]

I think the new mac pro so revolutionary that I do not know why anyone would NOT buy it and stay stuck in the past with the current Mac Pros. I know, it’s all about ..money..money..money..

As usual, there are a whole lot of reasons why I could argue your forceful, as usual, opinion. I know better.

[toodamnhip]

I think the new mac pro so revolutionary that I do not know why anyone would NOT buy it and stay stuck in the past with the current Mac Pros. I know, it’s all about ..money..money..money..

As usual, there are a whole lot of reasons why I could argue your forceful, as usual, opinion. I know better.

well, I think the opinions have flushed out. I say that a good yr until the 2nd generation update and manufacturer development make the argument to go ahead and buy a 5,1 more logical. So, I am modifying my "forceful argument" somewhat, but I am glad to provide food for thought about this "update" being more than just an update.
Mac leads the way on how we all work. They have made yet another big change now, making the central computer more dedicated and of a higher standard, and simultaneously opening up the peripheral market so that one may now truly customize the surrounding drives and interfaces. No one is right here, but what can be safely assumed is that it will be interesting to see how developers come to the table now that Mac has given us a new core system.
Again, let's see in a year how a 5,1 system looks when a bunch of new toys and interfaces using thunderbolt make us all drool. I suppose if one is stuck pre 5,1 Mac, the power limitations must really suck and the opportunity to AT LEAST get to 5,1 power at a lower price point is very tempting. So I suppose my initial argument is more for pros with the finance and fast enough present day system...to wait. No intent to be insensitive to those in tougher predicaments. I wonder what the true savings work out to be for a bargain priced 5,1 Mac as compared to the new mac + peripheral drives...etc???? I'd love to see that number. Then we can all really know what we are discussing. My recollection of the yrs of Mac is that we get more for about the same amount of money. That each new mac comes in at about the same price as the one2-3 yrs earlier, yet it is better. That is indeed a reason to buy a new computer yes?

[HCMarkus]

An only "incremental" power improvement in this new Mac??? What? It is my understanding that it is basically twice as fast.

http://www.macrumors.com/2013/11/06/a-c ... w-mac-pro/

I believe Geekbench to be the most relevant measure of performance for DAW users (short of running the DAWs themselves.) My hex 4,1 > 5,1 Geekbenches a tad faster than the nMP entry four-core. The top of the line nMP scores just under 30k on Geekbench, whereas the fastest 5,1 hits over 25k.

[bayswater]

My hex 4,1 > 5,1 Geekbenches a tad faster than the nMP entry four-core. The top of the line nMP scores just under 30k on Geekbench, whereas the fastest 5,1 hits over 25k.

Really? Who's done a Geekbench measure on the nMP? A result like that has got to lead to some second thoughts.

[toodamnhip]

An only "incremental" power improvement in this new Mac??? What? It is my understanding that it is basically twice as fast.

http://www.macrumors.com/2013/11/06/a-c ... w-mac-pro/

I believe Geekbench to be the most relevant measure of performance for DAW users (short of running the DAWs themselves.) My hex 4,1 > 5,1 Geekbenches a tad faster than the nMP entry four-core. The top of the line nMP scores just under 30k on Geekbench, whereas the fastest 5,1 hits over 25k.

I don't buy that article, too much speculation and too many factors of real world improvement not taken into consideration. Wait until the real computer comes out, full integrated with peripherals and various audio/monitor interfaces.

[James Steele]

Again, let's see in a year how a 5,1 system looks when a bunch of new toys and interfaces using thunderbolt make us all drool. I suppose if one is stuck pre 5,1 Mac, the power limitations must really suck and the opportunity to AT LEAST get to 5,1 power at a lower price point is very tempting.

I dunno... I have a 4,1 and just updated from my 1,1 and I'm pretty happy. You forget that not everybody works the way you do, pushing the limits. I'm not sure if you're one of the people with templates with hundreds of MIDI tracks, and you run lots and lots of VIs, but hey... I'm doing rock and roll songs! LOL I'm fine with what I have.

[Dan Worley]

Heck, I'd stay with my 1,1 if its future usefulness wasn't being squeezed out. Best computer I've ever had.

[toodamnhip]

Well, I hope that they come out with some really "neato" stuff to take advantage of thunderbolt and the new computer's capabilities...It's not just about power, I would be disappointed if they don;t come up with some new integration of a bunch of peripherals, some new, cool audio interfaces or something.. I mean, thunderbolt is supposed to be so much faster and allow for many more devices.....some new, cool things should be coming besides just power? Maybe a new, dedicated thunderbolt, lightening fast MOTU control surface?...oh yeah!!!

[mikehalloran]

I don't buy that article, too much speculation and too many factors of real world improvement not taken into consideration. Wait until the real computer comes out, full integrated with peripherals and various audio/monitor interfaces.

"too much speculation" -- that's a nice way of putting it. The machines will be out soon. Real world performance scores - yes, that's what people want to see. Dropping a race engine into my '58 Studebaker wagon would never turn it into a race car, ya know? (analog tape machines, Vega banjos and a Victorian house aren't the only vintage items I own)

I am going to need a new (or new to me) Mac in 2014. The nMP is a contender. I will not be an early adopter, however, and am not in a hurry. If I decide to go this route, I'll be checking the Refurb store, that is for certain.

Since I have my 2408 out on perma-loan to a friend and have no reason to want it back, the MOTU PCIe issue is off the table for me.

Well, I hope that they come out with some really "neato" stuff to take advantage of thunderbolt and the new computer's capabilities...It's not just about power, I would be disappointed if they don;t come up with some new integration of a bunch of peripherals, some new, cool audio interfaces or something.. I mean, thunderbolt is supposed to be so much faster and allow for many more devices.....some new, cool things should be coming besides just power? Maybe a new, dedicated thunderbolt, lightening fast MOTU control surface?...oh yeah!!!

Yes, now that 2nd generation TB is coming, it's about time that interfaces arrive that take advantage of the band width. So far, the only shipping products are old news mated with a TB card.

Where's the new gear with 48 simultaneous audio I/O, 3x16 MIDI + Video in a 2U space box?

[toodamnhip]

And I also have to wonder if MIDI latency can be improved with thunderbolt. I have always felt that usb was sluggish compared to the old serial ports from back in the day, let run MIDI through some lightening fast thunderbolt along with audio and see what we get yes?

[James Steele]

And I also have to wonder if MIDI latency can be improved with thunderbolt. I have always felt that usb was sluggish compared to the old serial ports from back in the day, let run MIDI through some lightening fast thunderbolt along with audio and see what we get yes?

Yeah... but there are a couple of problems with that. First off MOTU USB MIDI interfaces when used with Digital Performer had a feature... I think it was called AMT... where MIDI data was sent out to the interface ahead of time and buffered and then sent based on hardware timing of the interface or something like that. The timing with a USB MOTU inteface and DP was supposed to be BETTER than serial interfaces. You also of course are supposed to avoid using MIDI Thru on devices and put each device on it's own MIDI output of the interfaces.

Then... on top of that... hardware devices, especially earlier ones with weaker processors built in... could have sloppy timing and receive a MIDI note on message at their MIDI in and not play the note instantly or consistently.

[MIDI Life Crisis]

There are also Firewire MIDI devices that should theoretically outperform USB devices if bus speed is the question. I use the Track 16 for MIDI.and it doesn't seem any faster or slower for MIDI data than the ME128