Absolute crap of genre listings these days

[Prime Mover]

"We have both kinds of music, country AND western!"

<Rant>

I kind of feel like the Blues Brothers walking into Bob's Southern Bunker, more and more these days. Suddenly, all selections of genres seems focused into "crap I don't want". I'm talking about things like when I'm signing up for free publicity with Oasis, looking down the list of local radio stations, going online to search for music in various capacities. It's just dismal. Genre's all bunched up with detailed accuracy around kinds of music I don't particularly care about:

Acoustic
Roots
Folk
New Country
Hip-hop
Urban
Rap
R&B

Oasis, as great as they were at making my last CD, and really helpful along the way, shocked me with their utterly bizarre grab bag of genre listings. Something like 3 types of folk, a couple other random entries and "Alternative", which literally could include all types of rock and metal, jazz, and classical. What the heck? So you have a "Roots" and an "Acoustic" (which under the description is still referring to acoustic folk), yet you're going to group John Adams together with Radiohead, Megadeth, and Etta James. I just don't know what to make of this.

My girlfriend plays The Sims quite a bit. I know it's probably not the bastion of high culture, but it's had a decent track record of covering the basis in previous versions. She's a big metalhead (more than me), and showed me the rediculous selection on this latest version. Again, like 3 forms of urban, bunch of folk, some dark new wave (which is one style we tend to like). Only in their latest, like 8th expansion, did they release any normal rock music at all.

What's going on? I grew up in a time when "Rock" was synonymous with just about anything, now I feel like we're heading for a time when rock is like "what's that?" I never thought I'd see the day, but maybe rock music is going the way of jazz, completely out of the mainstream's perspective and relegated to "musician's music" or connoisseurs.

Is "rock" dead as a popular genre? Outlook seems to suggest "Yes".

But that doesn't explain the bunched up genre selections I see. Even if Rock is purposefully being ignored, why do we need 3 forms of folk, country and urban, when many other genres are neglected... genre's that I'm pretty sure ARE still pretty popular in the public eye.

[billf]

Is "rock" dead as a popular genre? Outlook seems to suggest "Yes".

But that doesn't explain the bunched up genre selections I see. Even if Rock is purposefully being ignored, why do we need 3 forms of folk, country and urban, when many other genres are neglected... genre's that I'm pretty sure ARE still pretty popular in the public eye.

I remember going into Tower Records and there would be a few categories. The rock category had everything, 50's, 60's, punk, metal, soul, reggae, and so on. These days the genres are so fragmented that I'm not certain anyone knows what they mean. I've bought stuff on iTunes (Amazon too) by the same band, same type of music, but the genres are listed different. So yeah, it really does seem to be a chaotic mess these days.

As for rock, history seems to show that every time it begins to get dismissed, it comes roaring back somehow.

[Prime Mover]

As for rock, history seems to show that every time it begins to get dismissed, it comes roaring back somehow.

I hope you're right, but there's nothing to suggest it won't dive underground for good. What we consider classical used to be much more popular than it is today (if more in the upper classes), jazz/swing, etc. New popular forms come and go. Obviously WITHIN the rock genre, the popular styles change every decade or so: rockabilly, classic, hard rock, prog (for about 2 minutes), punk, metal, new wave, alt rock, grunge.

The one thing that has changed is new subgenres used to pop up all the time. Maybe it was silly and many of them are very similar, but people cared enough to want to re-designate the music and move it in different directions. Elvis taught white people to like black music, the Beatles made rock dynamic and psychedelic, prog brought rock to the concert hall, punk said "f*** the concert hall!" and made it gritty again, metal said "you punks are screwing around, we're going to kick you in the face with our skills", new wave brought electronics into the fold, alt rock and grunge said "f*** electronics, back to basics!", Radiohead fooled us all by slipping electronics back in and making it popular again.

When was the last time that happened? Sure, the sub-sub genres get wacky new categories, but when was the last time we had an explosive new movement? It's those things that keep the genre alive and in the public eye. Yeah, drama is back and not shunned anymore, electronics aren't evil, we've made peace with the 80's and aren't threatened by it anymore, but I still hear everything called "Alt rock" (a 25 year old term) because no scene has put it's foot down and said, "Okay, you're going to listen to us for the next 5 years! We're called ____ rock!"

Fads are silly and ridiculous, but they do stir the pot and get people working in different directions.

[David Polich]

Let me put a little perspective on the "rock is dead" comment.

I was in Brighton, UK for rehearsals with the Cure (I'm their new keyboard tech) during the second week of July. There were nothing BUT rock bands rehearsing at the faciilty where we were. And the majority of bands playing in Brighton that month were rock bands. And by rock, I mean the bands all sounded like Oasis/Blur/Foo Fighters, etc. Real rock.

Two weeks earlier, my Pat Benatar tribute band played two shows, one at the House of Blues in San Diego, one at the House of Blues in Anaheim. Both times, the house was packed, and the audience treated us like rock stars. Not saying we deserved it, but there certainly was no lack of enthusiasm on the audience's part. The house was sold out on both occasions.

Let me assure you, rock is alive and well. It may not be chart-topping at the moment, but like sex and scrambled eggs, the basic premise is timeless and it will still be around after Rihanna and Pit Bull and Kanye and Katy and the rest of them are gone or have retired. You can't kill rock and roll. It will be as relevant in 2100 as it is now.

And speaking of the Cure, all shows on their recent tour were sold out.
And they will sell out the upcoming shows. If rock is dead, you wouldn't know it from the people who buy Cure tickets.

[twistedtom]

First let me say this; Dave I love the Cure, they have been a round a long time and are still going strong.
I agree much of the music out there would fit a number of categories, so it is often a bit ambiguous to put them in a narrow genre.
People love to categorize things. Not only that but people tend to identify with a cultural idea of them selfs, and then try to mold them selfs to be what perceive this requires. So it is of no surprise to me that they would do the same thing with music. Now there are some differences for sure, but often the genres cross over, and the so called genre could actually just a sub-group of a major genre, like rock.
There are lots of experts at things they know little about, and they tend to talk a lot of noise, so I just take that into mind when I hear crap.
I listen to a wide variety of music, I have a number of Pandora stations set up, some of the bands are places in a number of genres, and their profile reads differently; go figure!

[philbrown]

I'm not sure which is worse: lumping Cat Stevens, Metallica and Maroon 5 into "Rock" or this:

[bayswater]

Probably the same guys that used to compile the K-Tel records.

[Prime Mover]

Actually, I love the hell out of those trees! I find them as fun as ever. Can't say I agree with everything on there (lumping Rush, Dream Theat(er) and Meshuggah into one category seems bizarre), but such is genre placement, sometimes it's tough.

I'll say this though, not knowing electronic dance, they come up with some damn funny names, I specifically like:
- Booty House
- Happy Hardcore

Metal tends to be really descriptive with its subgenre names, which isn't as fun.

[philbrown]

I'll say this though, not knowing electronic dance, they come up with some damn funny names, I specifically like:
- Booty House
- Happy Hardcore

The emo-related ones are funny too like "shoegaze". Actually that one is pretty descriptive!

[Prime Mover]

The emo-related ones are funny too like "shoegaze". Actually that one is pretty descriptive!

Actually, I read up on that one and the whole name was an accident. One of the early bands of the genre did a show with a bunch of new songs and the singer wasn't confident with the lyrics so he taped some note cards to the floor and ended up staring at them. People thought he was staring at his guitar pedals (a staple of the genre) and they started calling it "Shoegaze", making fun of all the stompbox work. As a largely electronic musician that makes me a bit sad. Even if there's a lot of crap in that genre, the whole ambient electronics stuff is maybe the one thing I can respect and it's the thing it gets made fun of for! Try making fun of it for having crappy lyrics or being a total downer.

I'll admit, I have a few Faunts albums and I've found a few really interesting tracks. Lots of good builds, not something you hear in pop music these days. That said, most of the genre is really boring.

[twistedtom]

Shooshiegaze.