Complete freeze

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Klaus
Posts: 1174
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Complete freeze

Post by Klaus »

Trying to find out why a freeze happens…
-no log entry
- no mouse
- only hard reboot possible
In 1 year the 2nd time , no spec. heavy using so far

I searched the net
but would appreciate hints from here
TIA a lot and
best regards

Klaus
Klaus
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Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 10:01 pm
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Re: Complete freeze

Post by Klaus »

DiskWarrior reported available disk space was different...
could this be a cause for a complete freeze ?

Klaus
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mikehalloran
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Re: Complete freeze

Post by mikehalloran »

Klaus wrote:DiskWarrior reported available disk space was different...
could this be a cause for a complete freeze ?

Klaus
No. Disk Warrior cannot find nor fix any thing. It can help confirm a bad hard drive.

Please update your signature to include your system, OS, amount of RAM and version of DP.

I can never remember and you never include it.

The normal culprit is not enough RAM and/or failure to reboot often enough.
DP 11.31; 828mkII FW, micro lite, M4, MTP/AV USB Firmware 2.0.1
2023 Mac Studio M2 8TB, 192GB RAM, OS Sonoma 14.4, USB4 8TB external, M-Audio AIR 192|14, Mackie ProFxv3 6/10/12; 2012 MBPs Catalina, Mojave
IK-NI-Izotope-PSP-Garritan-Antares, LogicPro X, Finale 27.4, Dorico 5.2, Notion 6, Overture 5, TwistedWave, DSP-Q 5, SmartScore64 Pro, Toast 20 Pro
Klaus
Posts: 1174
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 10:01 pm
Primary DAW OS: MacOS
Location: Nordring 38, CH - 3013 Berne

Re: Complete freeze

Post by Klaus »

mikehalloran wrote:
Klaus wrote:DiskWarrior reported available disk space was different...
could this be a cause for a complete freeze ?

Klaus
No. Disk Warrior cannot find nor fix any thing. It can help confirm a bad hard drive.

Please update your signature to include your system, OS, amount of RAM and version of DP.

I can never remember and you never include it.

The normal culprit is not enough RAM and/or failure to reboot often enough.
Sorry…
10.7.5, Mac mini 2,1, 3GB ( 'uped 1,1 - 2GB to 4GB )
DP wasn't running at freeze ( but 1/2h before ) and iTunes.
I was getting dig distortion from the iTunes playback in combination with DP724 being ready to record ( 16 armed tracks ), therefore quit iTunes and relaunched DP's audio engine
This had happened before and I think it is iTunes related ( or buffer setting in DP ? )
BTW
DiskWarrior 'did' repair the info of available disk space…

Thanks again for hints
and best regards

Klaus
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MIDI Life Crisis
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Re: Complete freeze

Post by MIDI Life Crisis »

Mac Mini and OS 10.7 with 3GB of RAM.

I'd say there's the problem. While it may have been good once, technology has past that configuration long ago. I'm surprised you can do any work in DP except for the simplest recording and editing.

I don't say this to be demeaning. The demands on that system are enormous and the resources available are simply not sufficient, in my view. 16 armed tracks? I rest my case.

How big is the hard drive? Internal or external? USB or FW?
2013 Mac Pro 32GB RAM

OSX 10.14.6; DP 10; Track 16; Finale 26, iPad Pro, et al

MIDI LIFE CRISIS
Klaus
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Re: Complete freeze

Post by Klaus »

MIDI Life Crisis wrote:Mac Mini and OS 10.7 with 3GB of RAM.

I'd say there's the problem. While it may have been good once, technology has past that configuration long ago. I'm surprised you can do any work in DP except for the simplest recording and editing.

I don't say this to be demeaning. The demands on that system are enormous and the resources available are simply not sufficient, in my view. 16 armed tracks? I rest my case.

How big is the hard drive? Internal or external? USB or FW?
It actually does record only onto an ext. 128GB SSD over firewire…
no plugs or monitoring thru DP…just recording 16-32 tracks thru core audio USB,
and it does remote control of an X32Core ( X32-Edit v2.5 )
And eventually play music in iTunes thru core audio / USB back to the X32Core,
Activitiy monitor is @ half usage ( about )
These minis have done more than 500 gigs, and twice I had a freeze…
What exactly do you mean with 'demands on that system are enormous'
Are you saying 50% cpu usage is enormous ?
Are there hidden logs in OSX that show how a freeze was created ?

I only found this around the time of the freeze,
9/29/17 8:36:36.333 PM iTunes kCGErrorIllegalArgument: CGSOrderWindowList: NULL list pointer or empty list
9/29/17 9:21:34.081 PM iTunes kCGErrorIllegalArgument: CGSOrderWindowList: NULL list pointer or empty list
9/29/17 9:24:18.158 PM com.apple.usbmuxd stopping.
9/29/17 9:24:18.248 PM com.apple.usbmuxd usbmuxd-211 built on Feb 8 2011 at 13:49:43 on Feb 8 2011 at 13:49:43, running 64 bit
9/29/17 10:54:12.366 PM [0x0-0x1a01a].com.motu.DigitalPerformer no MotuPluginTypeUUID valueCouldnt get factory
9/29/17 11:16:46.504 PM Finder ISGetIconFamilyFromStorage: seed mismatch for 27f8000e, actual seed is 1190cde7
Memory related ?

Ah yes, I quit DP before the freeze
but this isn't in the log ( was before )

Thanks for help
and best regards

Klaus
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mikehalloran
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Re: Complete freeze

Post by mikehalloran »

DiskWarrior reported a non-problem and then ‘repaired’ it. It did not fix anything. Disk Utility could have also done the minor directory repair. DW did point to the possibility of a failing hard drive and that should be tested.

There is always the possibility that you may have a failing hard drive. Not enough RAM is the normal suspect; I didn’t say it’s the only possibility.

Boot from another drive. Run Disk Utility — if everything shows ok, that’s fine. If, however, anything shows up in red, keep running repair until everything is black or green. Then replace your hard drive ASAP and move your data off it. The repairs will be temporary only — that drive is toast.
DP 11.31; 828mkII FW, micro lite, M4, MTP/AV USB Firmware 2.0.1
2023 Mac Studio M2 8TB, 192GB RAM, OS Sonoma 14.4, USB4 8TB external, M-Audio AIR 192|14, Mackie ProFxv3 6/10/12; 2012 MBPs Catalina, Mojave
IK-NI-Izotope-PSP-Garritan-Antares, LogicPro X, Finale 27.4, Dorico 5.2, Notion 6, Overture 5, TwistedWave, DSP-Q 5, SmartScore64 Pro, Toast 20 Pro
Klaus
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Re: Complete freeze

Post by Klaus »

I run first DU > ok
Then DW and it fixed the available disk space info…
SMART status is ok to
Thanks Mike
Klaus
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mikehalloran
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Re: Complete freeze

Post by mikehalloran »

OK, back in the days where drives rarely gave more than 2-3 years service, I learned that SMART Status=OK sometimes gave false hope.

These TechTool Pro screen shots are from drives where DU gave the thumbs up and DW "repaired" minor problems.

Image

Image

https://a3-images.myspacecdn.com/images ... 6/full.jpg

A drive that looks like this is still good:

Image

This leads me more in the opinion that your big problem is not enough RAM. To minimize the possibility of this happening again, reboot before using DP and do not have other apps open, especially browsers or iTunes.

If your iMac can be upgraded to 8G RAM, that's the next place to sped money, followed by replacing your HHDs with SSDs.

OTOH, if your budget can handle a used iMac... a 2011 27" iMac i7 is really easy to upgrade and not too hard to find already equipped with an SSD and 16–32G RAM. If you really need to run OS 10.7, it will do so (these shipped with 10.6.3). It's the last year with FireWire and the first with Thunderbolt. You can even install 2 SSDs in it and keep the optical drive (last year for that, too). Like the 2010, it has three internal SATA busses; one is unused.
DP 11.31; 828mkII FW, micro lite, M4, MTP/AV USB Firmware 2.0.1
2023 Mac Studio M2 8TB, 192GB RAM, OS Sonoma 14.4, USB4 8TB external, M-Audio AIR 192|14, Mackie ProFxv3 6/10/12; 2012 MBPs Catalina, Mojave
IK-NI-Izotope-PSP-Garritan-Antares, LogicPro X, Finale 27.4, Dorico 5.2, Notion 6, Overture 5, TwistedWave, DSP-Q 5, SmartScore64 Pro, Toast 20 Pro
Klaus
Posts: 1174
Joined: Sat Oct 16, 2004 10:01 pm
Primary DAW OS: MacOS
Location: Nordring 38, CH - 3013 Berne

Re: Complete freeze

Post by Klaus »

Thought to report my findings…
First thanks for replies !
After opening activity monitor, I found 1 feature of the Behringer remote control software ( X32-Edit 2.5 ) that displays spectral content is doubling the amount of cpu usage,
thus the remaining cpu headroom is about 13 - 15%, and was probably responsible for the freeze when I am controlling a lot and fast via the Icon Platform M faderbox - or DP is creating a cpu peak during recording…or finalizing ?
I'm testing right now with this little headroom and hope I can reproduce the freeze…

PS Behringer made a newer version of the remote control software, that uses a lot less cpu, but is buggy as h**l

Best regards and thanks again
Klaus
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