MBP Freezes

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Todzilla
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MBP Freezes

Post by Todzilla »

My MBP: late 2011 15" Quad core i7 2.2GHz with newly installed 980G Crucial SSD, 16G of RAM. Running 10.7.5 OSX. Running DP 8.04

When running DP, MBP has started just "freezing" - stopping all audio, all screen updates, all cursor movement for anywhere from 0.5 to 10 seconds. It then resumes, picking up roughly from where it froze.

I need to look more closely at activity monitor, but it is vexing. I can make it worse by making changes to plug-ins while it's playing. None of this has occurred before the past week and a half. The projects I'm playing aren't particularly huge (maybe 4 virtual synths - mostly NI stuff, 24-50 audio tracks, a couple reverbs and compression and EQ on most channels.)

Any thoughts?

I am loathe to start upgrading OSs and applications capriciously, as they tend to have cascading effects on upgrading other tools.

Thoughts?
-Todzilla
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mikehalloran
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Re: MBP Freezes

Post by mikehalloran »

Step one: find the problem. Is it hardware or software? Gut reaction is to find te bad RAM or fix the loose connector butbtherebarebplenty of things that can be wrong.

Hardware

Do you have TRIM enabled through the command line or Trim Enabler.app? If not, do so. Is there 15% or more free space? Are the connectors to the drive secure? Are you sure?

What do you get when you run Verify Disk from Disk Utility.

What do you use to test RAM? TechTool Pro is the best. Whatever you use, test the RAM.

How old is the battery? Take a look to see if it has swollen and is pressing against the mother board or other vital components. My daughter's 2010 MBP was ruined this way. In mild cases, it could be restricting air flow. Most SSDs have thermal protection and shut down when overheated.

Do all your fans work?

Software

What does Console tell you when this happens?

Do you use any maintenance tools other than Apple Disk Utility?

When you formatted the drive, did you write free space to zeros?

What does DP's background processing window tell you? You can make it visible. I have found some unexpected conflicts that way.

Did you clone to make the boot disk or use migration assistant?
DP 11.31; 828mkII FW, micro lite, M4, MTP/AV USB Firmware 2.0.1
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Todzilla
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Re: MBP Freezes

Post by Todzilla »

Mike,

Thank you SO much for your response. I know some of the answers, but will have to research the rest.
Step one: find the problem. Is it hardware or software? Gut reaction is to find te bad RAM or fix the loose connector butbtherebarebplenty of things that can be wrong.
Do you have TRIM enabled through the command line or Trim Enabler.app? If not, do so.
I have not. I will check on this.
Is there 15% or more free space?
Yes, there's about 40% free space
Are the connectors to the drive secure? Are you sure?
i did this myself, so, no I'm not sure. I'll check
What do you get when you run Verify Disk from Disk Utility.
I'll check
What do you use to test RAM? TechTool Pro is the best. Whatever you use, test the RAM.
Never tested the RAM. I put cheap stuff in myself four years ago and it's run like a champ (until now?). I'll test it.
How old is the battery? Take a look to see if it has swollen and is pressing against the mother board or other vital components. My daughter's 2010 MBP was ruined this way. In mild cases, it could be restricting air flow. Most SSDs have thermal protection and shut down when overheated.
Original battery and in need of a replacement anyway.
Do all your fans work?
I think so, but I'll double check.

What does Console tell you when this happens?
Which console?
Do you use any maintenance tools other than Apple Disk Utility?
Nope
When you formatted the drive, did you write free space to zeros?
Nope. Just formatted using the disk utility.
What does DP's background processing window tell you? You can make it visible. I have found some unexpected conflicts that way.
I checked that and there was no background processing when this was happening. Closed all other apps too, to no avail.
Did you clone to make the boot disk or use migration assistant?
Straight clone. I did this twice before with no ill effects.

You have mentioned lots of hardware issues that trace to overheating. In fact, I've noticed my MBP is pretty damn hot when this happens. I'm going to concentrate on hardware first.
-Todzilla
Huge sound generation & capture facilities
On the banks of the River Eno
__________________________________________________
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Re: MBP Freezes

Post by mikehalloran »

Do check the hardware first.

If a bad battery, OWC has them plus the videos you need to install with confidence. If there's a bulge under the keyboard or trackpad, the battery is bad. Open the back of the case so you can let it expand into air. My daughter's ballooned in a few hours on a day I was out of town –– too late.

Console.app is in your Utilities folder. It gives a readout of every process. Sometimes, when a Mac freezes, you will see something ancient like, say 2005 HP printer drivers or 2009 Finale Help files trying to access DP. Why? Old code. Removing the old junk fixes you up. If you see the Mackie HUI plugins failing to load, reinstall DP (shouldn't be your issue). There will be a ton of error messages that mean nothing if everything is working. You will be looking for specific, repeatable activities that happen when your Mac freezes.

Cloning copies the crap. Normally not an issue on a Mac. However, since 10.7, if you created your boot drive via cloning, you need to reinstall the OS. This creates the hidden repair partition on the drive. If OS 10.7 is in your Purchase list from the App Store, you can download it from there and reinstall – it will be 10.7.5.

Enable TRIM. You can find a set of terminal commands to do so in 10.7 but downloading and installing Trim Enabler from Cindori is easy – the basic functionality is free but the $10 unlocks additional features like a temperature report. There is no down side before Yosemite (and no up side since OS 10.10.4).
https://www.cindori.org/

If you are able to make clones successfully, that is often an indicator that RAM is good.
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Re: MBP Freezes

Post by artfarm1 »

Mike H. is an expert, so listen to him! His advice has saved me over the years!

FWIW... also, try (or buy!) Disk Warrior from Alsoft.

I just upgraded to the newest version, and it fixed my wife's frozen MacBook Pro problem (video screen was acting weird after a clone-from-old-macbook and the computer was freezing when trying to also open iPhoto, iMovie, etc. etc. .... we thought the video card was dying and feared the worst!)

But, Disk Warrior to the rescue. It fixed up the disk and did a Permissions Repair, etc. and everything is normal.

It's a little miracle software that is good to have on hand.
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Re: MBP Freezes

Post by Todzilla »

I think I found the problem.

During a drop out while working on a particularly demanding DP project, I noted lots of idle resources in RAM, CPU, disk storage, but disk I/O was hitting the ceiling, apparently at the time of the drop out. This latest 960G SSD is one in a line of Crucial drives that, up until now, have performed beautifully. What do I do? Enable trim? It looks like I have to upgrade OSX in order to enable trim on a third party drive, which I would LOVE to not do, for the sake of system stability, but I will if it's my only route.

Oh, upgraded the battery while I was at it.

Thoughts?
-Todzilla
Huge sound generation & capture facilities
On the banks of the River Eno
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Re: MBP Freezes

Post by mikehalloran »

Download and install Trim Enabler.app. OS 10.7 is the minimum system requirement. He has an older version available for 10.6.8 and earlier.
https://www.cindori.org/software/trimenabler/

The basic functionality runs for free – doesn't even ask for marketing info on the download (how nice is that?). $10 unlocks other features including a much nicer SMART monitor than Disk Utility and temperature reports, especially useful if heat is the suspect.

Yes, there is a set of terminal commands but they are a pain and you have to find the right set that actually works. Beginning with OS 10.10.4, there is a simple terminal command but it doesn't work backwards.
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Re: MBP Freezes

Post by Todzilla »

Thanks so much, Mike!

A $10 fix will be sweet indeed!.

Running Lion, so the current version should do fine. :dance:
-Todzilla
Huge sound generation & capture facilities
On the banks of the River Eno
__________________________________________________
DP 8!!!, OSX 10.7.3, 15" MacBook Pro w 16G RAM 256G SSD & 630GHD, MOTU 896HD, MX4, Komplete 8, Apogee Symphony I/O, Neumann U-89, pair of Peluso P12s, Seventh Circle & Demeter preamps, Lava lamp, stuffed frog playing bongos
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Re: MBP Freezes

Post by mikehalloran »

When you install Trim Enabler, you will get the opportunity to purchase Disk Sensei instead at @ $19.95.

https://www.cindori.org/software/disksensei/

It's a little confusing but you don't need both. Disk Sensei has all of the charts and graphs you could ever need– and even I don't need them. Anyway, Disk Sensei requires OS 10.9 or later.
DP 11.31; 828mkII FW, micro lite, M4, MTP/AV USB Firmware 2.0.1
2023 Mac Studio M2 8TB, 192GB RAM, OS Sonoma 14.4, USB4 8TB external, M-Audio AIR 192|14, Mackie ProFxv3 6/10/12; 2012 MBPs Catalina, Mojave
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Re: MBP Freezes

Post by James Steele »

Todzilla wrote:Thanks so much, Mike!

A $10 fix will be sweet indeed!.

Running Lion, so the current version should do fine. :dance:
Just heed the warning to launch Trim Enabler and disable, then reboot before zapping NVRAM otherwise your Mac won't boot. When that happens, easiest way to fix it is reinstall the OS on the drive.
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Re: MBP Freezes

Post by mikehalloran »

James Steele wrote:
Todzilla wrote:Thanks so much, Mike!

A $10 fix will be sweet indeed!.

Running Lion, so the current version should do fine. :dance:
Just heed the warning to launch Trim Enabler and disable, then reboot before zapping NVRAM otherwise your Mac won't boot. When that happens, easiest way to fix it is reinstall the OS on the drive.
Only an issue in OS 10.10 to 10.10.2 and I'm not even sure of that (web site isn't clear). It was never an issue in OS 10.7 -- 10.9

With Trim Enabler 3.4, Oskar fixed that for OS 10.10.3 on and I have tested it in OS 10.10.5 by resetting the NV RAM and doing a Safe Boot without a problem..
DP 11.31; 828mkII FW, micro lite, M4, MTP/AV USB Firmware 2.0.1
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Re: MBP Freezes

Post by James Steele »

Oh good. It was scary when you had to always remember that. :)
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Re: MBP Freezes

Post by Todzilla »

Installed Trim Enabler a week ago. Been using DP on the same projects as before. Everything seems cool now.

Mike, you're my hero.
-Todzilla
Huge sound generation & capture facilities
On the banks of the River Eno
__________________________________________________
DP 8!!!, OSX 10.7.3, 15" MacBook Pro w 16G RAM 256G SSD & 630GHD, MOTU 896HD, MX4, Komplete 8, Apogee Symphony I/O, Neumann U-89, pair of Peluso P12s, Seventh Circle & Demeter preamps, Lava lamp, stuffed frog playing bongos
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