Building a computer for DP

Discussion of Digital Performer use, optimization, tips and techniques on Windows.

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jazzylee77
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Building a computer for DP

Post by jazzylee77 »

I'm biting the bullet and setting my goal for a better computer. The basic fact is, even with running a vep slave, my current system is just laggy enough to keep me from advancing and using Digital Performer. Current motherboards are limited in RAM expansion, 4G on one, and not sure but some other small amount on the other. (trust me it's time to move on)

I don't tend to have piles of money sitting around (If I have it I tend to blow it on entertainment or helping others) and I'm not great at saving; so I plan to buy piece at a time forcing me to tighten my belt rather than trying to tighten the belt and saving to buy. Knowing who I am, it's the head game I play. Also taking a little time, I may find some good sales for certain parts.

I'm pretty solid in my CPU choice: i7 6700k
I've read arguments for a cpu in the 58xx range that would put me in a motherboard of the future, but I'm going with a build the best I can afford now and replace in 2-4 years philosophy.

I'm also set on having 32G of fast RAM expandable to 64G. Overkill for now I know, but I want to leave that starving for RAM feeling in the dust. Never again.

I am also biased toward Samsung SSDs.

Beyond that, my partpicker list is a random whatever looks like it would work collection open to changes. I have 64G RAM listed just to insure compatibility if needed. Will only buy 32G to build.

My DAW Build Parts List

Image

I went with windows7 pro since there have been hints of problems with 10 and DP. Maybe that will be a non issue by the time I get around to the OS purchase. Likely the last thing I get. Then I can change my signature line.
Last edited by jazzylee77 on Sun Oct 09, 2016 6:43 pm, edited 3 times in total.
DP8 - Windows 10 - i7 4ghz - 32 GB RAM - All Internal SSD harmonica with only one broken reed, lava lamp, cordless drill
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HCMarkus
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Re: Building a computer for DP

Post by HCMarkus »

I hope that's not really a Samsung 840 EVO in your list... go with the 850 series for sure. There are issues with 840 EVOs that have been addressed in a band-aid fashion with a firmware update that moves stored data around the drive to keep it fresh.

850s, with 3-d NAND, are waaay more robust and have not exhibited the stale data issue that plagued the 840 EVO drives.
jazzylee77
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Re: Building a computer for DP

Post by jazzylee77 »

HCMarkus wrote:I hope that's not really a Samsung 840 EVO in your list... go with the 850 series for sure. There are issues with 840 EVOs that have been addressed in a band-aid fashion with a firmware update that moves stored data around the drive to keep it fresh.

850s, with 3-d NAND, are waaay more robust and have not exhibited the stale data issue that plagued the 840 EVO drives.
Cool. Thanks for the heads up.
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stubbsonic
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Re: Building a computer for DP

Post by stubbsonic »

I admire your system config in your signature.
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mikehalloran
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Re: Building a computer for DP

Post by mikehalloran »

There is no reason to have two SSDs unless both of them are going to be large. There is no advantage to having a small one as your boot drive and storing everything on a larger one. With Windows 10 you are just inviting more problems.

Street$ on the 1T 850 EVO is around $300. The 2T is under $600.
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HCMarkus
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Re: Building a computer for DP

Post by HCMarkus »

stubbsonic wrote:I admire your system config in your signature.
I'd be remiss if I did not +1 this astute remark.
jazzylee77
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Re: Building a computer for DP

Post by jazzylee77 »

The really dumb thing about those 840 SSD's is just a couple weeks ago I bought an 850 after researching and hearing about those very problems with the cheaper 840. I guess I was distracted by the cost per Gig stat column.

But that's the point of posting this here.
mikehalloran wrote:There is no reason to have two SSDs unless both of them are going to be large. There is no advantage to having a small one as your boot drive and storing everything on a larger one. With Windows 10 you are just inviting more problems.

Street$ on the 1T 850 EVO is around $300. The 2T is under $600.
Wonder where I picked that notion up? Probably when learning about SSD reading old articles - recalling hearsay --- Hard drives tend to gradually fail and you might lose some data. SSDs live longer but fail catastrophically. Therefore only put stuff you can replace on SSDs. Of course with backups you should be able to replace anything... incremental improvement advice seemed commonly to be at least get the OS and host software on an ssd.

If it is more stable I'll gladly ditch the 2 ssd approach and get a 2 T ssd. I have a 2T external drive for other storage and backup. Is this (two drives thing) the source of many of the Window 10 issues? (or is that a separate subject and warning to just stay away from 10?) The constant checking and reporting sounds annoying.

Sort of on the SSD subject. I saw a video of a guy with a ridiculous low latency computer where he had 2 SSDs set up in a Raid 0 array. I suppose Windows 10 would see that as one disc though?
DP8 - Windows 10 - i7 4ghz - 32 GB RAM - All Internal SSD harmonica with only one broken reed, lava lamp, cordless drill
jazzylee77
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Re: Building a computer for DP

Post by jazzylee77 »

Ditched the fan since the case comes loaded with 3 and switched the ram so it looks like this now.


My DAW Build Parts List

Image
DP8 - Windows 10 - i7 4ghz - 32 GB RAM - All Internal SSD harmonica with only one broken reed, lava lamp, cordless drill
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mikehalloran
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Re: Building a computer for DP

Post by mikehalloran »

How do you plan to back up your work? Unlike the Mac where Time Machine is the norm (and works extremely well), there are a number of proven backup schemes for Windows.

Here is one place I'll recommend a mechanical HHD. Speed is not an issue for automated backup since, after the first, subsequent backups are incremental. The WD Red is a low energy-consumption drive designed for sustained heavy use (NAS requires a very heavy duty drive). They come recommended by friends of mine who work for other HD companies as WD uses a heavier bearing in these. Lower energy use = less noise and heat. A 6T drive should last for years as a backup drive to a 2T system.
https://www.amazon.com/Red-3TB-Hard-Dis ... 3KR96?th=1

I've been replacing the 3T drives in my Time Capsules as warranties expire. Since I back up a number of machines on my network, I'm using 8T drives.
DP 11.31; 828mkII FW, micro lite, M4, MTP/AV USB Firmware 2.0.1
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jazzylee77
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Re: Building a computer for DP

Post by jazzylee77 »

mikehalloran wrote:How do you plan to back up your work? Unlike the Mac where Time Machine is the norm (and works extremely well), there are a number of proven backup schemes for Windows.

Here is one place I'll recommend a mechanical HHD. Speed is not an issue for automated backup since, after the first, subsequent backups are incremental. The WD Red is a low energy-consumption drive designed for sustained heavy use (NAS requires a very heavy duty drive). They come recommended by friends of mine who work for other HD companies as WD uses a heavier bearing in these. Lower energy use = less noise and heat. A 6T drive should last for years as a backup drive to a 2T system.
https://www.amazon.com/Red-3TB-Hard-Dis ... 3KR96?th=1

I've been replacing the 3T drives in my Time Capsules as warranties expire. Since I back up a number of machines on my network, I'm using 8T drives.
Once again thanks for the input. That drive looks like a great deal for local backup.

My backup method will depend on whether it's windows 7 or 10. Windows 10 has built in features similar to time machine and a system image backup and restore. So there is a check in Win10s pro column. I'll postpone that whole debate till I'm ready for the OS (May be 2-3 months) maybe windows 10 issues will be sorted out or better understood by then.

Windows 7 I currently do a manual backup from it's backup and restore. Other stuff additionally goes to drop box and google drive. But I'm not doing much anything important on the home puters right now.
DP8 - Windows 10 - i7 4ghz - 32 GB RAM - All Internal SSD harmonica with only one broken reed, lava lamp, cordless drill
jazzylee77
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Re: Building a computer for DP

Post by jazzylee77 »

A couple items I've left off.

I have external optical drives, so feel no need for another.

Video Card. Likely I'll end up adding one. I know I don't need a major 3D gamer card. Might be fine without one at all. Not sure what the sweet spot will be for ram and speed and other mysterious video specs that may take the load off the CPU.

The i7-6700k has Intel® HD Graphics 530. Maybe I'll be fine with that or consider a later upgrade.
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bayswater
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Re: Building a computer for DP

Post by bayswater »

jazzylee77 wrote:Ditched the fan since the case comes loaded with 3
Do you know the noise level for the fans? Fans you can hear can be really annoying.
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jazzylee77
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Re: Building a computer for DP

Post by jazzylee77 »

bayswater wrote: Do you know the noise level for the fans? Fans you can hear can be really annoying.
I think I'll be ok. A test heremeasured the 3 fans in a similar case @ 37db. Audio recording in the room will be rare. If it is a distraction to monitoring I guess I can replace the stock fans. I will likely remove the hard drive bays in this large case and possibly install some sound foam in places that don't interfere with air flow. Orrrr now that the quiet bug is in my ear I might consider a quieter case. I just like the size and features of this roomy box for my large hands and moderate level of hardware experience.
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HCMarkus
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Re: Building a computer for DP

Post by HCMarkus »

jazzylee77 wrote:
bayswater wrote: Do you know the noise level for the fans? Fans you can hear can be really annoying.
I think I'll be ok. A test heremeasured the 3 fans in a similar case @ 37db. Audio recording in the room will be rare. If it is a distraction to monitoring I guess I can replace the stock fans. I will likely remove the hard drive bays in this large case and possibly install some sound foam in places that don't interfere with air flow. Orrrr now that the quiet bug is in my ear I might consider a quieter case. I just like the size and features of this roomy box for my large hands and moderate level of hardware experience.
Large case is usually good for cooling. A little of that dampening stick on material can do wonders, too, not to mention putting the case behind an acoustic baffle.
kdm
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Re: Building a computer for DP

Post by kdm »

Honestly, I would be hesitant to stick with Windows 7. My DP9 system is similar to your build here though a model older i7, 64G, Asus X99 board, multiple SSDs; running Windows 8.1 and DP 9.12. No problems with the OS side.

I also have DP running on a Win10 Surface and it seems fine there (other than a screen maximizing problem with DP as it isn't technically compatible with a tablet-oriented windowing system).

You may find Win7 limited in a year or two when you want to upgrade other applications, or perhaps DP.
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