How does DP do this?

[waxman]

This video has a guy doing edits on a Raven. This post is not about the Raven. I would like to know of a way of fixing out of time kicks like this does in PT... I do something like it in DP but it is much more cumbersome. The second part of making a MIDI track I can do from pitch but it's not as easy as this appears. So check out the short video if you can and let me know how DP does this.

http://www.tubechop.com/watch/8785095

[Robert Randolph]

This video has a guy doing edits on a Raven. This post is not about the Raven. I would like to know of a way of fixing out of time kicks like this does in PT... I do something like it in DP but it is much more cumbersome. The second part of making a MIDI track I can do from pitch but it's not as easy as this appears. So check out the short video if you can and let me know how DP does this.

http://www.tubechop.com/watch/8785095

This is actually really easy in DP. I can make you a video and a text walkthrough tomorrow or later tonight.

Do you need to warp the tempo to the kick first, or are you working with something that was recorded to a metronome but slightly off?

I'm not at my DP system right now.

edit: Meanwhile if you have not watched this 5-part series then give it a shot: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TmbwZpqyypU

Most of what I'd explain is there. Workflow is basically getting beats analyzed, get tempo correct, new soundbites from beats, quantize, smooth audio edits, merge soundbites.

In my experience DP is the only DAW that can do this as well as PT, even though PT does still have some slight advantages in this workflow.

[terrybritton]

Meanwhile if you have not watched this 5-part series then give it a shot: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TmbwZpqyypU

That's a really great series!

Terry

[waxman]

This is actually really easy in DP. I can make you a video and a text walkthrough tomorrow or later tonight.

Do you need to warp the tempo to the kick first, or are you working with something that was recorded to a metronome but slightly off?

No warp just tightening up... I do use the beat analysis on DP.. I find the threshold settings kind of touchy... And yes love to see a video of how you do what you do... I am doing a live hi hat with BFD3. The hi hat is always ahead 10 to 30 ticks just due to the VI's processing. When I tighten up the BFD3 groove or even if I don't touch the MIDI the live hat needs to sync. So I just do it in sections. I would love to have the hat automatically sync to the drums. Either MIDI or with the audio rendered.

[philbrown]

I have a question about the first video. Are these MIDI-derived tracks? I don't see any way you could quantize only the kick if it was a full-miked up drum set without having ridiculous phase issues.

I haven't watched the other videos but I will.

[waxman]

I have a question about the first video. Are these MIDI-derived tracks? I don't see any way you could quantize only the kick if it was a full-miked up drum set without having ridiculous phase issues.

I haven't watched the other videos but I will.

Hi Phil,

There are some DP vids by David Das that go into how to do that with the whole set including overheads without phase issues. Here is one of them...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bkUSohn ... nel=motuTV

[philbrown]

I have a question about the first video. Are these MIDI-derived tracks? I don't see any way you could quantize only the kick if it was a full-miked up drum set without having ridiculous phase issues.

I haven't watched the other videos but I will.

Hi Phil,

There are some DP vids by David Das that go into how to do that with the whole set including overheads without phase issues. Here is one of them...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bkUSohn ... nel=motuTV

Thanks wax. I do it old-fashioned but always with the whole set grouped together. I look forward to watching the vids.

[Robert Randolph]

I haven't forgotten about this... I just haven't been able to get to my studio computer today.

[waxman]

all good... thanks

[Robert Randolph]

Ok, screenflow isn't working so I'll do this another way.

The thing shown in a video is a macro that Raven does. There isn't a button PT that does all these things at once. Here's what's happening but in DP, you can create a macro that does these steps rather easily.

Start with your file:



Find Beats:

This can be set to be automatic in Preferences->General->Background Processing->Beat Analysis defaults.



In the video this is done by PT automatically similar to having "Always look for beats automatically in any project that is opened" setting turned on.

Split:



Make sure the soundbite is selected and use Audio->Audio Beats->New Soundbites from Beats. The Shortcut in OS X is ctrl-B.

Quantize:



Open the quantize dialog with all the soundbites selected (Cmd-0 in OS X). Make sure "What to quantize" is set to 'Soundbites'. A setting of 16th notes is usually good enough for most tempos.

I usually like to have Strength set to 25-50%. If I want it more quantized then I will repeat that step. (I know it's 75% in the image. I was doing something else earlier)

Apply.

Smooth and Fill:



Now use Audio->Smooth Audio Edits (ctrl-shift-A in OS X).

The settings I like are shown above.

Crossfade:



I do not like to use the crossfade option in 'Smooth Audio Edits' because it applies some unnatural sounding crossfades to percussion parts.

Instead I open the Audio-Fade dialog (ctrl-F in OS X) and use the pictured settings.

Note: The 'before' time can be up to 1/32nd note long and it will usually sound fine. The 'after' time needs to be short for percussive material or it will sound bad. Settings of even 30/2 sound better still on many things. 15/5 is a decent average setting in my experience.

Conclusion:



That's it. You're done!

This is not an automatic workflow in PT. Raven is executing a number of commands in a row to achieve this workflow. You have to have various settings set appropriately for it to work like it does in the video same as DP.

For me, I only ever use the Fades dialog and 'Smooth Audio Edits' for this task, so their settings are always the same. Quantize is almost always set the same as well.

Thusly you can either manually do, or create a macro that does:

• Ctrl-B
• Cmd-0
• Enter
• Ctrl-Shift-A
• Enter
• Ctrl-F
• Enter

I can complete this entire thing in 5.5seconds. I timed it, and that's including processing time.

You can also do this just as easily to multiple grouped tracks if you do the 'copy beats' workflow. I can explain this as well if necessary, but it's in the video series that I linked.

[terrybritton]

This is gold - pure gold, Robert! Thanks so much for taking the time to give us this!

Terry

[philbrown]

Super helpful info, Robert. Much appreciated!
I think I'm going to go through those MOTU videos, combined with your info and make some workflow cheat sheets to follow for various specific scenarios.

[waxman]

Thank you Robert you crushed it...

Do you find you need to manually adjust the green handle bars in the image below? Kicks drums are pretty consistent but hi hats are irregular.



I thought this was not about the Raven but it turns out the voodoo macro is Raven. Thanks for pointing that out and thanks for showing the quick keys which is exactly what I will use to program Raven.

Robert in my view you are moving into the legendary Shooshie territory tossing up succinct tutorials like this on M-nation. THANKS SO MUCH!!!

[philbrown]

Robert in my view you are moving into the legendary Shooshie territory tossing up succinct tutorials like this on M-nation. THANKS SO MUCH!!!

^ AGREE!

[philbrown]

I hope this isn't too far afield - Robert or anyone -
Say you're quantizing a drum kit and the song is a medium blues shuffle or a swingy hip-hop type beat. How do you guys deal with that at the quantizing stage? I'm working on two songs right now that are exactly that. In this case, both are recorded to a click track. The hip-hoppy one we just tracked drums on yesterday with a drummer that is really good, but not Jim Keltner (surprise!) so this is all very timely.