DP wins again

[dewdman42]

I just wanted to share an experience this week. Recently I decided I wanted to try out Logic Pro for a bit to see how the workflow is. I actually put quite a bit of time into it, even learned my way around the Environment.. I was interested in it primarily because I just find their GUI easier to look at, no other reason. The piano roll, the way the consolidated window works, the way regions form easily into bar divisions, etc..it just is smoother and in some ways more musically intuitive for me, and I still feel that way.

But...

For one thing, it crashed on me... a lot. Even blue screened several times. I found on the net some stuff about my particular MBP having a flakey GPU on the motherboard and Apple used to replace them for free, but stopped doing so last year. My Apple Care ended last year. So does that mean i'm stuck with a MBP that has a flakey GPU that could blue screen at any moment? Well no other app has causes this blue screen...only logic. Just sayin'

Then on top of that, it comes up A LOT with a message about mis matched sample rates between it and the built in sound card on my MBP. Looked around the net and found other people with similar problems and no clear solution. It was doing it a lot..

And finally, one simple task I wanted to figure out was how to utilize Jamstix plugin, which outputs MIDI, but Logic does not currently allow MIDI to be routed from AU instruments. What plugin makers have had to do is to send MIDI out through IAC and loop it back around. Ok, but Logic makes even that difficult since it feeds all incoming MIDI through one sequencer port and has what I consider brain dead ways to dynamically redirect the MIDI to the track you want. So then I spent MANY hours learning about the Environment and drawing on paper diagrams of hwo to patch together some kind of MIDI cabling that would let me work with Jamstix. And I sorta got it to work...well mostly...with still some weirdness related to timing, Jamstix doesn't want to play correctly in sync with Logic unless that track is selected, etc. yada yada yada..basically I finally made it work and basically had to become proficient at the Environment, which is crafty...but not efficient...and due to the single sequencer port limitation, still ultimately limited by that.

So then I went back to DP...and wow... the MIDI and audio routed effortlessly between Jamstix and SSD4. It just worked. No audio glitches. no crashes. no environment cabling and drawing pictures on napkins. DP wins and I'm not switching to Logic.

Yes, I still prefer some aspects of Logic Pro, it has some incredibly great instruments, I like their piano roll and region editing a lot better...I think the GUI for DP is tiny and and difficult to see and work with on my laptop, Logic's gui is much easier to look at and in some ways I find it more musically intuitive for the composing and writing process. Much easier to setup and remember drum maps, mapped instruments, etc. I just like the way their GUI works honestly, I think Apple got that right....But the MIDI routing was a complete nightmare and all the crashes too. DP wins.

[Robert Randolph]

Your macbook pro may still be covered: https://www.apple.com/support/macbookpro-videoissues/

I have the same one and Apple has been helpful with it.

I had the same issue with only one program causing the crashes (gcc actually), but eventually it will just die. It's not logic's fault as much as it is any application that you use a cpu/gpu in. That causes the gpu chip to essentially desolder itself.

You would very likely eventually fry that computer with DP too if you were doing anything to cause it to run hot. 1000's of people have had it happen to them, regardless of the applications they use.

[dewdman42]

I just found out about this because of Logic crashing now when I finally got around to trying it. When I go to that site and enter my serial number it says Apple is not supporting my MBP anymore because it was manufactured in 2010. I bought it at the start of 2011, give or take and I paid for Apple care also, which expired last year. It will be worth a try, but it seems Apple is only fixing 2011 or newer...even though 2010 MBP's are also effected.

DOn't get me started that I will be extremely displeased if Apple doesn't fix the computer for a reasonable cost. I have heard it can cost $900, which is not reasonable.

[mikehalloran]

For me, Logic Pro exists so that I can export GarageBand and Logic files, then import them into DP. It's inexpensive and it has paid for itself many times over.

There are those 13G of loops and EXS24 VIs you get with it but, if that's all you want, they come with Main Stage, too @ $29.95. Because of that, either lets you cross-grade into MachFive3 if you want – another benefit.

It's a tool. If it helps anyone make music, that's great. As long as I never have to use a splicing block again, it's all good (but I agree, DP is better!).

Actually working in LPX? My daughter does but I'll pass.

[Robert Randolph]

I just found out about this because of Logic crashing now when I finally got around to trying it. When I go to that site and enter my serial number it says Apple is not supporting my MBP anymore because it was manufactured in 2010. I bought it at the start of 2011, give or take and I paid for Apple care also, which expired last year. It will be worth a try, but it seems Apple is only fixing 2011 or newer...even though 2010 MBP's are also effected.

DOn't get me started that I will be extremely displeased if Apple doesn't fix the computer for a reasonable cost. I have heard it can cost $900, which is not reasonable.

I do suggest taking it to an Apple store if it's not much hassle, sometimes they can waive those fees in situations like this. I've had it happen before.

[dewdman42]

I'm planning to. I live an hour away from the nearest apple store so its not going to happen that soon. I already tried to Onyx my machine too so now I need to wait for it to crash a few more times so I have some logs. It doesn't happen often and has nothing to do with heat either. A few days ago it happened while launching Logic Pro. no plugin loaded, nothing, just starting up the program and when the new project wizard came up, thereabouts, bluescreen.

The thing is, I don't really want to waste any more time with Logic...so.... how can I get it to bluescreen and make some logs to bring to Apple?.. it doesn't happen that often. I can go a few days without incident....using Logic a lot...and then out of the blue....it will crash...

[Robert Randolph]

I'm planning to. I live an hour away from the nearest apple store so its not going to happen that soon. I already tried to Onyx my machine too so now I need to wait for it to crash a few more times so I have some logs. It doesn't happen often and has nothing to do with heat either. A few days ago it happened while launching Logic Pro. no plugin loaded, nothing, just starting up the program and when the new project wizard came up, thereabouts, bluescreen.

The thing is, I don't really want to waste any more time with Logic...so.... how can I get it to bluescreen and make some logs to bring to Apple?.. it doesn't happen that often. I can go a few days without incident....using Logic a lot...and then out of the blue....it will crash...

Just find something that uses a lot of cpu/gpu and run it for a while. I don't know what you have access to, but I'm sure DP could do it with a bunch of plugins. If it is this type of problem, that will do it.

Take note of what time of day it crashes, as they may be able to check the logs for info about the accident.

Of course, it's also possible it's something else entirely... but there's only one way to find out.

[dewdman42]

Yea like I said, it happened the other day under no load whatsoever...and other times it has ran for days with lots of load and no problem. I don't know how to induce it.

after it happens a few times I can take the logs to Apple and beg mercy

paid a lot for this MBP, quad core, maxed out mem, SSD, etc..its still totally usable. Hard to believe Apple would put out such crap hardware for the price it charges...honestly..but let's see what happens. If they replace the board, which they might not, but if they do, maybe I'll get a few more years out of it before the next board craps out...but by then it might finally be time to upgrade...though... I don't want to give up my matte screen, which they don't make anymore.

[Shooshie]

Just my 2¢:

It's not a zero-sum game. That is, it's not like one has to lose for another to win. If you have Logic, Pro Tools, and DP, you win 3 times! Each has its advantages for various people. I'm one who prefers DP for everything, so it doesn't matter to me. My last copy of Logic was some iteration of Logic 8 Studio. I really learned to dislike it then, so I stopped using it, but I kept it around in case I needed to transfer files, and so forth. But I don't really need it for that, either.

Nevertheless, because some people like certain things about Logic, I encourage them to use it for those things. I waist a hardware store the other day and saw a display of short-handled hammers. They look bizarre, with regular sized hammer head, but a stunted handle just long enough to fit in your hand. Immediately I remembered many times when such a tool would have come in handy, but I didn't buy it. Still, I'll bet that some people have a number of different kinds of hammers, and they use them each when the situation calls for it. That's the best way to think of DP, Logic, PT, and other DAWs. Until you find THE one that you plan to use exclusively for the rest of your life, why exclude other tools that may prove useful, even if only on rare occasions?

I try not to think of the world in terms of zero-sum. It's a non-zero world.

Shooshie

[mikehalloran]

If you have Logic, Pro Tools, and DP, you win 3 times! Each has its advantages for various people. I'm one who prefers DP for everything, so it doesn't matter to me. My last copy of Logic was some iteration of Logic 8 Studio...

Agreed.

I still have that 11lb LS 8 brick sitting on my shelf. I weighed it on my 50lb postal scale just because I was curious.

[Morpheo]

If I didn't know DP so well and I had to start from scratch, I guess I would go with Logic, $200 and a truckload of VIs seems like a no-brainer. I also bought Logic Studio 8 ages ago and really, really wanted to like it... The interface was a total mess for me, being so used to DP and Pro Tools. Not just the interface actually... Frankly I don't have the energy to learn LPX even with its much more friendly UI. The DP/PT combo works just fine and I can live with their weaknesses. Right now I think the most annoying aspect of DP, for me, is the size of the text, what's next helvetica 2.5?