Why do you like/dislike consolidated windows?

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musicman691

Re: Why do you like/dislike consolidated windows?

Post by musicman691 »

magicd wrote:
mikehalloran wrote:I pop the mixer out and put it on a second monitor. Otherwise, I leave everything in the CW.

Now, with floating windows for plugins, I am playing with those on a third USB monitor where if is shared with the user guide. I'm not sure I will keep that gong, though.
Funnily enough, I can't work with the floating plug-in windows. I find the feature to be a pain. I absolutely recognize that others find this feature indispensable. It's nice to have choices!

Dave
I love floating windows - now I don't have to wonder what happened to my open fx or vi window. What I like about DP's version is that I can have more than one open at a time without clicking the little red square in the upper right of a window like I have to do in ProTools.
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Shooshie
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Re: Why do you like/dislike consolidated windows?

Post by Shooshie »

I love Consolidated Windows, but as most people know, I use it in an odd fashion. I like the CW for Tracks Overview, Sequence Editor, and all the "little" windows.

But I keep the Mixing Board, MIDI Editor, and plugins (and VIs) in separate spaces, each with its own space, each occupying all the screen it needs to be as functional as possible for me.

I came to this odd-way of working, because I never liked closing and reopening an edit window or mixing board. They didn't always reopen to where I left them, or the same zoom level, or whatnot. Window Sets are nice, but they incorporate the zoom level and anything else into the set, so when you set it, it takes you back to square one. By that time, I may have evolved the window position, shape, and most certainly the scrolling and/or zoom. I may have added another window alongside the edit window, or a bunch of plugins around the mixing board.

What I'm saying is that I'm always changing things. Window Sets don't change. Consolidated Windows just can't hold multiple edit windows to the size that I want them to be. Basically, I don't want to scroll vertically in an edit window. I want to see ALL THE NOTES, ALL THE TIME. It's like looking at a score. What if you had to scroll your score to find what you're hearing? Uh-uh. Not me.

SO... What I want is to be able to go somewhere else and come back to EXACTLY what I left. Not "almost exactly." I want it exactly where I left it, exactly the same size, and I don't want to have to figure out where I am and get back to where I was. Basically, if you want that 100% of the time, it means you have to leave several windows at full-screen, and not have to scroll them around a lot.

For me, Spaces was the only answer to that. I can zip to the window I want and find it exactly where i left it. Sure, there's the minor annoyance of having to "deal" the windows to their respective spaces when you open a file, but I really want my windows this way, badly enough that this minor annoyance pales by comparison to the way I would have to work if I didn't do that.

The great thing about the Consolidated Window is that all the little windows in it update when you change chunks or open a file. I wish ALL windows could do that. I mean, it would have to be a preference option, but I would love it if there was a preference option to update all windows when you change chunks. That would make the screen/window management of DP practically perfect in every way.

I completely understand several ways of working. If you like all-Consolidated Windows, I get that. If you like NO CW, I get that, too. If you like a mix, I get that (because that's me). But most of all, I find Spaces indispensable. I would hate not to have the CW for keeping all those little windows organized and updated. I would hate it if I could not pop out the windows of my choosing and take them to other Spaces, where I could leave them open the way I last worked in them. DP gives me everything I want, except for the preference for automatic edit-window updating (like the mixing board) when I open a new chunk.

I've used DP since the beginning, and have enjoyed the ride most of the time, but I've always wished for some kind of streamlined way of getting around. Now, we have it. I could not be happier with that. (with the one aforementioned exception)

Shooshie
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Michael Canavan
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Re: Why do you like/dislike consolidated windows?

Post by Michael Canavan »

MIDI Life Crisis wrote:
Robert Randolph wrote: What do you dislike about it? I can't think of any downsides on first consideration.
For me, they clutter the screen. Once I set a plug I don't need to have it showing all the time. It's usually a "see it and forget it" think for me. I open them when I need to fight with them. So I like having them disappear after I've had my way with them.
For me it's great to have both options. floating windows disappear when DP is not selected, meaning that they really cannot be moved to other desktops in OSX. So larger GUIs that you might want to use all the time like NI Maschine for instance work IMO better as non floating moved to another desktop. On the other hand when you need to edit a plug in quickly and will be messing with things in DP as well it's easier for me to have the window floating and get rid of it when done, considering GUIs take up CPU resources.
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Babz
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Re: Why do you like/dislike consolidated windows?

Post by Babz »

MIDI Life Crisis wrote:
Robert Randolph wrote: What do you dislike about it? I can't think of any downsides on first consideration.
For me, they clutter the screen. Once I set a plug I don't need to have it showing all the time. It's usually a "see it and forget it" think for me. I open them when I need to fight with them. So I like having them disappear after I've had my way with them.
The thing is, they don't disappear. They just go to the back, where the are using up resources -- the whole "pre-rendering" thing, only works and frees up resources when you close the plug in window. But I often find I have all these forgotten windows lurking back there eating resources.

So, really, if you're done with them, it's best to get in the habit of closing plugin/VI windows, instead of letting them "disappear" to the back. Now with floating plugin windows, it should be easier than ever to keep track of where they are.

For me, the "plugin" I most often have open is a virtual instrument, usually Kontakt, usually several instances of Kontakt. So having to dig through and find them in the back all the time has been a real pain.

I'm not on DP 9 yet, but this is the main feature I'm looking forward to, but who knows? Careful what you wish for, they say. :mrgreen: I'm hoping it's not just plugins, but things like the Quantize window too.

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Re: Why do you like/dislike consolidated windows?

Post by tonyvose »

I must say, I dislike con windows & don't use that feature. I basically mainly use the Sequence Editor, the Mixing Board, and Tracks Overview windows. I love using the key commands to access each of these, and I only want to see one of them at a time. I especially like to be able to see the whole mixing board. I find Con Windows a bit annoying, and it always seems difficult to "turn it off"; it doesn't want to stay "off". My own opinion/ method of working. (I suppose I need to look & see if it is still able to be disengaged in DP 9....)
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Re: Why do you like/dislike consolidated windows?

Post by stubbsonic »

Take a quick look at at this thread. It will tell you what you need to know...

http://www.motunation.com/forum/viewtop ... 26&t=60171
M1 MBP; OS 12, FF800, DP 11.3, Kontakt 7, Reaktor 6, PC3K7, K2661S, iPad6, Godin XTSA, Two Ibanez 5 string basses (1 fretted, 1 fretless), FM3, SY-1000, etc.

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Re: Why do you like/dislike consolidated windows?

Post by tonyvose »

Ahh -- Thanks Jon. Looks like it's entirely doable to continue Not using con windows in DP9. Cool -- thanks again --- Nick
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musicman691

Re: Why do you like/dislike consolidated windows?

Post by musicman691 »

I decided to give the non-consolidated window thing a shot and for the short time I've been using it I like it. Combined with Window Sets I could very easily get used to this.
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Re: Why do you like/dislike consolidated windows?

Post by Guitar Gaz »

musicman691 wrote:I decided to give the non-consolidated window thing a shot and for the short time I've been using it I like it. Combined with Window Sets I could very easily get used to this.
Remember you can use Window Sets in Consolidated Windows - I have Window Sets which change the main window in the CW from Tracks Overview to Sequence Editor or MIDI Editor and back again. So you don't have to use mouse clicks to change the main window in CW. And with Full Screen mode working properly again this gives you more screen real estate to play with (plus you can use the reduced size Control Panel to give more edit space). Window Sets have always been the way forward - but they are not just restricted to non CW editing.
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musicman691

Re: Why do you like/dislike consolidated windows?

Post by musicman691 »

Guitar Gaz wrote:
musicman691 wrote:I decided to give the non-consolidated window thing a shot and for the short time I've been using it I like it. Combined with Window Sets I could very easily get used to this.
Remember you can use Window Sets in Consolidated Windows - I have Window Sets which change the main window in the CW from Tracks Overview to Sequence Editor or MIDI Editor and back again. So you don't have to use mouse clicks to change the main window in CW. And with Full Screen mode working properly again this gives you more screen real estate to play with (plus you can use the reduced size Control Panel to give more edit space). Window Sets have always been the way forward - but they are not just restricted to non CW editing.
Never said window sets were restricted to non-CW work. I've used them sparingly with the CW; it's just that at least for me window sets make working in non-cw mode a bit more enjoyable than not using window sets.
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Re: Why do you like/dislike consolidated windows?

Post by MIDI Life Crisis »

FWIW I crashed DP9 and corrupted the file. Specifically the window set was placing the Quickscribe window in front. MOTU has the file and confirmed the crash.
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musicman691

Re: Why do you like/dislike consolidated windows?

Post by musicman691 »

MIDI Life Crisis wrote:FWIW I crashed DP9 and corrupted the file. Specifically the window set was placing the Quickscribe window in front. MOTU has the file and confirmed the crash.
You corrupted the session file by using a window set? Was this a ws you made or a stock one?
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Re: Why do you like/dislike consolidated windows?

Post by MIDI Life Crisis »

2013 Mac Pro 32GB RAM

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Re: Why do you like/dislike consolidated windows?

Post by yamguitar »

I have never gotten really comfortable with the consolidated window. I love its neat look, and I want it to work for me, but I frequently find that once a project has more than a dozen or so tracks, it means I have to constantly use the mouse to see what I want, as opposed to just jumping rapidly between several maximized windows with key commands... that seems a shame to me. I also feel I can never see enough of the sequence editor with it squished at the bottom of the screen in the lowest cell.

My biggest issue with the CW is that certain kinds of info can only be docked to horizontally- or vertically-oriented windows. For example, I like to have my meter bridge be the full height of the screen... much easier to see when I'm across the room trying to juggle a guitar, a bluetooth keyboard and a music stand. As I'm usually recording myself, I generally only need to see a couple of inputs on it at a time. It seems silly to me that if I use the consolidated window I'm forced to dock it in a horizontally-oriented window, in which I can see meters for dozens of unused inputs/outputs, but be denied the full height (and thus the full visibility) of the input meters when I'm trying to set levels. It's very rare for me to have more than four musicians maximum in the studio at a time, so having a zillion visible meters that give less obvious information is much less valuable to me than having a big, fat meter I can easily use for the other 90% of the time when it's just me tracking solo in the studio.

That said, I have been trying to use the CW for a while now, seeing if I can find a way in which it will help my workflow. So far, the most obvious is that I like having my desktop totally obscured by DP when I'm deep into mixing... somehow I find it less visually distracting and more satisfyingly console-like. (Not that I have ever really used a console that much.)
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Re: Why do you like/dislike consolidated windows?

Post by Gravity Jim »

You're not forced to use a horizontal window for the mixer. I have mine docked in a vertical window on the side all the time, and it scrolls to whatever track I select. "A shame?" Seriously? Does it also make you "sad," in the Internet sense of the word? It's just a UI choice, bro. Get happy.

Anyway, I thought I'd never stop using free-floating windows, but now I'd never go back. The CW just makes organizational sense. It kills clutter, which I hate. Neat, clean, smooth... I like my workspace pin-tidy. I have one display filled with the CW, the other filled with plugs, etc. (I don't mix ITB, so I never need to see a big mixing console on screen).

In fact, here's a suggestion for MOTU: What if V-Rack were displayed as a rack? A Consolidated Window for the plugs in your V-Rack? That would be awesome. The under-thumb button on my Logitech mouse engages Exposé, and that's a handy way to uncover a given VI or plug in, but scrolling through a virtual rack would be the bee's. IMO, that is.
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