Thinking about getting a mastering app... What do you use?

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billf
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Re: Thinking about getting a mastering app... What do you us

Post by billf »

mikehalloran wrote:Weird Izotope's assertion that reverb isn't part of mastering. With acoustic recordings, it is usually my final step when I am going for the most natural sound.
The only thing I can deduce is that Izotope "decided" we can use third party verbs in the Ozone 6 app, so the module wasn't needed. I really hope they will just admit it was a bad move and put the reverb module back in.

It really should be left up to the user.
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Re: Thinking about getting a mastering app... What do you us

Post by mikehalloran »

bayswater wrote:Amount control is like a wet/dry percentage for each module.
My definition, too. That's why the statement made no sense. If he means something else. I'm curious as to what it is.
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Re: Thinking about getting a mastering app... What do you us

Post by musicman691 »

mikehalloran wrote:
bayswater wrote:Amount control is like a wet/dry percentage for each module.
My definition, too. That's why the statement made no sense. If he means something else. I'm curious as to what it is.
Here's the reference for the amount control in Ozone 5; there's both a global and module control. http://help.izotope.com/docs/ozone/page ... ntrols.htm
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Re: Thinking about getting a mastering app... What do you us

Post by monkey man »

I know this much:

Dropping the 'verb would amount... to less.

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Re: Thinking about getting a mastering app... What do you us

Post by mikehalloran »

Here's the reference for the amount control in Ozone 5; there's both a global and module control. http://help.izotope.com/docs/ozone/page ... ntrols.htm
Thanks for clarifying. Now I know what you mean.

It's still there but they've changed the name and look and didn't make mention of it. This, apparently confused everybody including me till I researched the documentation and opened Ozone 6 to check. Being an Advanced user, I usually access the individual modules and almost never open the consolidated version (it's always there in the menu if I want, though).

Anyway, what used to be Global Amount Control in previous versions is now the panel on the right called Input/Output Gain
. You'll find it on page 22.
downloads.izotope.com/docs/izotope-ozone-6-help.pdf

BTW, Version 6.1, released last March, restored the individual module presets that many complained about when they went missing in Ozone 6. These made it into the latest documentation above which is good, otherwise, one is unlikely to figure out how to access them.
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Re: Thinking about getting a mastering app... What do you us

Post by musicman691 »

mikehalloran wrote:
Here's the reference for the amount control in Ozone 5; there's both a global and module control. http://help.izotope.com/docs/ozone/page ... ntrols.htm
Thanks for clarifying. Now I know what you mean.

It's still there but they've changed the name and look and didn't make mention of it. This, apparently confused everybody including me till I researched the documentation and opened Ozone 6 to check. Being an Advanced user, I usually access the individual modules and almost never open the consolidated version (it's always there in the menu if I want, though).

Anyway, what used to be Global Amount Control in previous versions is now the panel on the right called Input/Output Gain
. You'll find it on page 22.
downloads.izotope.com/docs/izotope-ozone-6-help.pdf

BTW, Version 6.1, released last March, restored the individual module presets that many complained about when they went missing in Ozone 6. These made it into the latest documentation above which is good, otherwise, one is unlikely to figure out how to access them.
Thanks for the explanation. It is confusing; even some reviews I've read don't make the connection.
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Re: Thinking about getting a mastering app... What do you us

Post by mikehalloran »

Thanks for the explanation. It is confusing; even some reviews I've read don't make the connection.
I saw that too. One guy is moaning that the individual modules are always on and can't be bypassed. Huh? Click on the x and it goes away, click on the space at the right to bring it back or add one from the menu. What could be easier?

Actually, a little page clearly stating the GUI differences between the two versions on page 4 or 5 of the Help Guide would have been nice.
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Re: Thinking about getting a mastering app... What do you us

Post by mhschmieder »

I posted a problem report on SoundBlade HD over on the miscellaneous forum last night, and thought I'd review what people said in this earlier discussion about mastering apps on the Mac.

I'm going to see if I can find out anything useful on GS about some of the choices that have come up, but am also going to sift through this thread to see if anyone came up with a convincing proposal for using DP for mastering.

I am primarily focusing on Mastering this week, but just wanted to bump this topic first as a way of alerting people to the other post, as I talk about more than SoundBlade there.

I'll update this post during the week as I get deeper on each of the apps that I audition for the Mastering task. I know a lot of people have been frustrated by the slow adoption of 64-bit support in this one area of Mac applications. Hopefully I'll learn something useful to share. :-)

UPDATE: After reviewing the entire thread, I see that Dave Polich had the same problems I did with the soundBlade demo, so I am deleting my separate post on that problem report from last night, and placing it here for context.

-------------------------

After deciding I do not like StudioOne's Project Mode for Mastering, while finally giving it a spin tonight, I am so stuck regarding lack of 64-bit options for Mastering on Macs.

So, I downloaded a demo for SoundBlade HD 2.2.1. No go; too many attempts to launch it have crashed or frozen with my CPU at 100% and Out of Memory (yikes; I have 16 GB!).

Is Digital Performer the only app that has a decent plug-in validator? I know people complain about it here, but quite frankly, every other app that I have is far more crash-prone on plug-in validation and much less likely to provide feedback during the process itself.

SoundBlade does NOT update its GUI while trying to validate plug-ins. I have given up; I need to get this album mastered now that we finally have final mixes, and the iLok license based demo expires in 14 days.

Not sure if I'm eligible to try WaveEditor again, but it's a new version by now so maybe they aren't complete idiots in that regard (several companies only let you try once-in-a-lifetime).

I suppose I could try Triumph again as well, even though I couldn't get my head wrapped around it when it first replaced WaveEditor.

My backup plan is to apply plug-ins one-at-a-time in iZotope RX, as before. It doesn't support a plug-in chain, unfortunately, or simultaneous monitoring via a Master Fader or the like.

Once the mastering itself is done, I could use DSP-Quattro (which is 32-bit-only) for CD assembly, DDP, CD-Text, etc.

It would have been nice to have been able to try SoundBlade, but I suspect it is yet another piece of software that isn't really being maintained or developed going forward.

Worse comes to worse, I can grin and bear it and use StudioOne. I don't like how they impose workflow on you, and I especially dislike the integration with Song Mode (though you can ignore it, it nevertheless is how the app is setup to work and thus it is more work to use StudioOne JUST for mastering).

I consider it dangerous to combine mixing with mastering via automatic linking. Sure, it "saves time", but the whole point to me is to get into a completely different app and mind space when mastering. I don't mind the "extra time" in managing file transfers between programs, as it gives me a chance to do sanity checks and verify status as well as document things.

Maybe DP would be the best bet after all, if finding a new workflow that keeps Mastering completely separate from Recording and Mixing. For instance, using Sequences and Chunks in a way that decouples (also via a separate DP Project) the Mastering from the Mixing altogether.
Last edited by mhschmieder on Mon Jul 20, 2015 1:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Thinking about getting a mastering app... What do you us

Post by mhschmieder »

Looks like DSP-Quattro is still under active development after all, and that the vendor is busy at work on a 64-bit port.

According to their website, they released an iOS app at the end of last year that uses the new 64-bit engine slated for the next DSP-Quattro update.

That doesn't help me for this week's mastering job, but maybe encourages me not to spend more money now (I regret buying StudioOne), and just doing piecemeal plug-in rendering using iZotope RX followed by DSP-Quattro for CD Mastering of the Audio Mastered files.

I'll keep reading the posts here, as it is a recent enough topic that most people were discussing options in a very current context (albeit pre-DP9).
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Re: Thinking about getting a mastering app... What do you us

Post by mhschmieder »

I have consolidated the most important information from this thread and have decided that we can all bank on DSP-Quattro for the longer-term future of quality CD Mastering support on the Mac, and Audio mastering as well (once the 64-bit port is complete).

All of the concerns, lack of flexibility, or missing features, were addressed by followup posts, and like others, I have had excellent interaction with Stefano (though it's been awhile). I also like the overall layout and workflow of the app, unlike the others I've tried. It reminds me a bit of Peak, only better in some ways.

That leaves me with how to deal with this week's Audio Mastering chores, before getting to DSP-Quattro for final assemblage, as I don't want to bother with plug-in hosts at the Audio Mastering stage and none of my most critical plug-ins work in 32-bit mode anymore.

As described earlier, my fallback is what I've been doing so far this year, with incremental plug-in rendering via iZotope RX (since it doesn't support plug-in chains).

I feel relieved that this thread saved me a LOT of research time and demo mode fumbling. Now I can focus on getting deeper on DP9 and seeing how I might come up with a distinct decoupled workflow for Audio mastering, using Song Mode, Chunks, or other mechanisms (or just a separate Project dedicated to Mastering vs. Mixing and Recording).

If I come up with something truly elegant, I'll post it here.
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Re: Thinking about getting a mastering app... What do you us

Post by mhschmieder »

Since I need to buy Apple's Logic Pro X anyway for some advanced MIDI features that are unique to that app, I looked up Mastering in Logic today and printed out some articles.

I may find it is well-suited for that task, and ideally decoupled from using Digital Performer as my main app for Composing, Recording, Arranging, and Mixing.
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Re: Thinking about getting a mastering app... What do you us

Post by mhschmieder »

Having read through all the materials I printed out, I think Logic Pro X will be far better suited for independent mastering (that is, Mastering that is independent of Mixing) than Studio One.

I'm going to give it a try tonight or tomorrow, and from this fresh perspective, then try to re-apply whatever I came up with in a DP context and see if I'm just as well off setting up a Mastering Template and document a workflow for DP for Mastering Projects that are deliberately separate from, and decoupled from, Recording and Mixing Projects.

I still plan to use DSP-Quattro for CD Assembly and related tasks, and to switch to that product for Audio mastering as well once the 64-bit version is released (hopefully later this year).
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Re: Thinking about getting a mastering app... What do you us

Post by bayswater »

mhschmieder wrote:Having read through all the materials I printed out, I think Logic Pro X will be far better suited for independent mastering (that is, Mastering that is independent of Mixing) than Studio One.
What did you find in Logic that makes it more suitable for this than other apps?
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Re: Thinking about getting a mastering app... What do you us

Post by billf »

bayswater wrote:
mhschmieder wrote:Having read through all the materials I printed out, I think Logic Pro X will be far better suited for independent mastering (that is, Mastering that is independent of Mixing) than Studio One.
What did you find in Logic that makes it more suitable for this than other apps?
I'm wondering the same thing.
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Re: Thinking about getting a mastering app... What do you us

Post by mhschmieder »

Specifically than Studio One; that was all I said. Sorry if that isn't clear.
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