Adding a tempo click to a non-quantized track

[cowtothesky]

Hi everyone,
I am wondering what the best technique is for adding a click track to a non-quantized performance. For example, I performed a piano track that I freely played without quantizing or keeping to a click track. Now, what I want to do is go back and have the sequence meter follow the tempo of that performance, rather than following a strict tempo. I don't want the music to sound rigid and lack the emotion.

I know there is a way to program tempo changes from the conductor track by programming ritards and tempo changes, but if I could just use a click pad or something to follow my performance, I think it would be easier and faster.

Do any of you do this kind of thing and, if so, offer some tips?

Thanks in advance!
Dave

[b.g.]

I would use Adjust Beats.

[NazRat]

There's a five part series on YouTube MOTU TV that will show you how to do that.

http://www.youtube.com/user/motuTV/videos

[MIDI Life Crisis]

I've done this a fair number of times using tap tempo. Haven't used it in a while and seem to recall it was broken at some point. Here's the instructions on the MOTU site for DP 4:

http://www.motu.com/techsupport/technot ... 2186229314

[MIDI Life Crisis]

Also, Shooshie contributed to the following page with important info. Search the page for "tap tempo."

http://fatlab.com/blog/2009/10/28/dp6-b ... rformer-7/

[stubbsonic]

I suspect the OP is talking about an audio recording of a piano track.

But just out of curiosity, does the process differ if the track was a MIDI track vs. an AUDIO track?

I would think in any case it would be wise to create a duplicate chunk to keep the original intact.

[bayswater]

I've tried various approaches. The one I like best:

1) record a basic track without clicks etc.

2) record a second track, MIDI track with a hi hat (or similar) sound that plays along with track one, and shows clear transients.

3) adjust the positions of the MIDI event of this second track as much as you want to get it right, (even putting some events where you think the beats on the first track ought to be, rather than where they actually sit -- later you can quantize some or all of the original track).

4) Do adjust beats using the second track.

One reason I like this approach better is that your original track, unless it is very simple is going to have a lot of places where transients are less than obvious, while the second track will show them clearly. Another is that your final click need not be linked to exact positions on the first track. Sometimes, that's the way you want it, sometimes you want something to quantize the original track to, other than itself.

[b.g.]

+1, bayswater.

[magicd]

+2 bayswater, especially for a solo rubato instrument.

Dave

[bayswater]

For the record, I think this is a DP strength. It's very difficult to get right, and keep things sounding musical. DP gets a lot closer than Logic and Cubase, neither of which deal with unquantized material and variable tempo well (IMO).

[FMiguelez]

I've tried various approaches. The one I like best:

1) record a basic track without clicks etc.

2) record a second track, MIDI track with a hi hat (or similar) sound that plays along with track one, and shows clear transients.

3) adjust the positions of the MIDI event of this second track as much as you want to get it right, (even putting some events where you think the beats on the first track ought to be, rather than where they actually sit -- later you can quantize some or all of the original track).

4) Do adjust beats using the second track.

One reason I like this approach better is that your original track, unless it is very simple is going to have a lot of places where transients are less than obvious, while the second track will show them clearly. Another is that your final click need not be linked to exact positions on the first track. Sometimes, that's the way you want it, sometimes you want something to quantize the original track to, other than itself.

+3 Bayswater.


However, if I may, there's a way to avoid the monotony and tediousness of point 4, especially if it's a long complicated piece.
This trick was taught to me by member B.G., and it's quite clever.

Summarizing:
You create a hardware MIDI loop.
If you drag to a new track some of the notes of the original MIDI performance, you can use RECORD BEATS in "automatic mode", so you don't need to do the tapping yourself. You do this by fooling DP... Once you have the (hardware) MIDI loop set, and the necessary notes in the "fool" track, all you have to do is solo the track, invoke record beats, play the sequence and lay back in your chair as you watch DP doing ALL the work for you, with the utmost precision. Each note in this scratch track will be a tap in Record Beats mode.
You can do this by sections, depending on the music.

For this to work, you need to know what notes to copy to the new track (notes that fall on the beat, or even all of them, or maybe 16th notes). It depends on how you want CT to click and how much detail you need. You can always change the way the CT clicks, and you can change the notation by messing with Scale Tempo and Scale Time commands afterwards if necessary.

It has helped me enormously, and it is pretty cool

You can find all the details here, if you're interested:
http://www.motunation.com/forum/viewtop ... op#p301302

Now, if the Extract Tempo from MIDI command worked as it's supposed to, none of this would be necessary, but unfortunately, that command has been broken since at least DP4, and MOTU seems to have forgotten all about it.

MOTU, PLEASE fix the Extract Tempo from MIDI command!!!

[FMiguelez]

I just found a very old video I had done demonstrating the above technique, and also showing how the Extract Tempo from MIDI command did NOT work then.

In this particular example I taped the "tapped" notes as I played the melody, but the same can be achieved by selecting the right notes from the performance and dragging those to the special MIDI loop track.

http://www.motunation.com/forum/viewtop ... ct#p353730

[cowtothesky]

Thanks everyone! You have given me a lot to try out. Yea, it is a MIDI track. I just turned the click off and played it on piano with emotion and tempo fluctuations. I may or may not keep the piano and just build full orchestra around the tempo and melody. But, I wasn't sure how to easily record the conductor to follow it. I have done non-quantized many times before, but I have never adjusted the tempo to actually follow it.

[Shooshie]

For the record, I think this is a DP strength. It's very difficult to get right, and keep things sounding musical. DP gets a lot closer than Logic and Cubase, neither of which deal with unquantized material and variable tempo well (IMO).

You are correct, at least in regard to Logic. I kind of assume that Cubase is similar, but I have no experience with it. Logic has features for mapping beats to unquantized material, but compared to DP it feels like a Fisher-Price toy. It's been a few years since I've done that, so I guess it could have gotten better. If not, then DP is way out in front of the competition in this regard.

Shooshie