Low Latency suggestions

[swpowe]

I'm thinking of getting a new interface for use with DP (and possibly Pro Tools and Logic) and I'm looking for some suggestions. 95% of what I currently do is working with virtual instruments so my first concern is drivers/latency. I'm looking for something that has some great drivers and low latency i/o. I am also looking for something that is either expandable or has some nice pres built in if I do end up needing to track some live instruments. I hope to get into location sound more in the future but not now.

I've of course looked at MOTUs interfaces. RME is another one I hear good things about. I currently have the original DUET which sounds nice but the drivers have been buggy and I don't know enough about interfaces and drivers to know if I could get better performance with a different device. Firewire is my preference but Usb of course works as well. Suggestions? I've found good info online but a lot of what I've found seems a little outdated. I want to make sure I don't go off old data and purchase something base on that.

Specs:
Mac Pro (2010) Westmere 2.4 quad
32GB RAM
Mavericks
DP 8

[OLB]

This year I went for the Metric Halo ULN-2. I cannot recommended it enough.

Super solid drivers, low latency. Two very clean preamps (TRS or mic). Build in mixer is so flexible, you can route every channel to wherever you like. Plus you can have the DSP fx for direct monitoring f.e.

They have also fantastic support. They have future compatibility for all of their products. Even the more than 10 years old 8228.
A few weeks ago they announced their new technology. Pretty amazing. Link

It's firewire and I'm running it now with a thunderbolt-firewire converter to my new Mac Pro. Flawless.

I believe you can even run it bus powered but have a look yourself.

[Shooshie]

Please explain: how does the audio interface affect the latency of virtual instruments? I don't see the connection, and I've been doing virtual instruments for a long, long time.

You should consider the MOTU 896mk3. I just replaced my original firewire 896 a month or two ago, and I've been pleasantly surprised by its capabilities. It's a very nice interface, and one of the things that sets it apart from the competition is CueMix FX. It's extremely well done. The interface adds virtually no detectable latency.

Latency is generally a factor of the computer you're using and the software you're running. Some VIs simply add a lot of latency. Others, no. It's all in the CPU overhead, the complexity of what is running. With a powerful 12-core Mac Pro and 40GB RAM, I can get latency down to a very low level with sample buffers set at 128 or even 64. The main trick is to avoid audio plugins, or at least avoid the ones with look-ahead functions, multiple stage processing, multiple bands, big CPU bite, etc. You can add the Trim plugin to any number of tracks without affecting the CPU overhead hardly at all. Simple compressors and EQs won't add much delay. You just have to experiment. Better to process a submaster aux track than individual tracks.

Also, rather than plugins, you may wish to use CueMix's built-in FX to help reduce latency. It's got a nice set of processors, and they work at hardware speeds.

Just my opinion, but honestly I can't think of a situation in which I have ever thought that replacing my audio or MIDI interfaces would reduce latency.

Shooshie

[Killahurts]

Just my opinion, but honestly I can't think of a situation in which I have ever thought that replacing my audio or MIDI interfaces would reduce latency.

Shooshie

Exactly. The only time that would work is if you have a hardware play through going on.. other than that, it's the settings, and whether or not the processors can handle it.

[James Steele]

Maybe they're talking about latency while monitoring a live source during recording. Even still, seems like that is also a function of the computer's processor power, yes? And of course, if you're using a MOTU interface, you can use Cue Mix, so then latency isn't really an issue at all when recording unless you're trying to monitor through plug-ins. Hmmm...

[OLB]

Interesting..

So you guys don't think the quality of the audio interface drivers have an impact on the load of the CoreAudio? You have quality interfaces as well, Motu, RME, SSL. In combination with a 12 core, yes I'm sure you get low latencies

My previous interface was the RME Fireface 800. Also very solid but the Metric Halo gave me slightly better performance in DP. I do agree that the CPU matters most but the OP has that sorted.

So would the DAW performance be the same with a cheap audio interface?

[swpowe]

I'll admit I may be misunderstanding the role the interface and drivers play with virtual instruments and the CPU load. I've been using virtual instruments for a long time and always thought that the interface didn't have an impact unless you were doing live audio monitoring but as I've tried to improve my performance I've found info online as well as from some hardware manufacturers that have led me to believe that the drivers do indeed make a difference in the overall performance. I don't know if that's true or not. I was hoping others on this forum might be able to help shed some light. I've got the original DUET right now which I can say the drivers haven't been totally solid. I don't know how much they are affecting performance but because they've been a bit flaky that started me on the research path to see what I should purchase to replace it.

I could totally be wrong on the latency thing.

[mikehalloran]

I'm with Shooshie on this. Any of the Hybrid interfaces will do what you want depending on your input requirements. CueMix FX makes latency a non-issue.

MOTU is very responsive with new drivers. Even when they hiccup (extremely rare), they are quick to get it fixed.

I'll admit I may be misunderstanding the role the interface and drivers play with virtual instruments and the CPU load

Yep. Shouldn't be an issue unless say, running on a Core Duo maxed out with 1G Ram - then everything affects cpu load.

[Shooshie]

I just thought of a possible exception to the rule. If an audio interface was partially driver-based, that might put a load on the CPU. BUT... if it can be used as a stand-alone audio interface, then there should be no work off-loaded to the driver and CPU.

It's possible, I suppose, that a cheap interface could utilize the computer for some of its processing. I don't know anything about it. I'm just throwing that out there as a "possibility" and not as something I've seen or read. I do remember many years ago having devices that shared the DSP of an AV Mac. I think that was called the "GeoPort." It DID do that, and allowed external devices to utilize the DSP, which was similar to the Altivec coprocessor in later PowerMacs. So... it's very possible that some audio interfaces might be designed that way.

MOTU PCI interfaces are designed to work in conjunction with the PCI card, so they cannot function as stand-alone boxes, but as far as I know, the PCI card does all the work. I do think the driver carries the CueMix interface and effects, so there may be some overhead there, but it does not affect latency of the box itself. CueMix still delivers real-time hardware monitoring if you desire.

MOTU Firewire/USB/Thunderbolt audio interfaces are definitely not made that way. They function with or without the Mac.

Shooshie

[swpowe]

A quick follow up question...Do any of MOTUs interfaces allow you to record directly onto an iPad? Or are there any out there that do? I've only heard mention of an RME interface that allows you to do this but I have to believe there are others. Not sure if this is the best place to ask that question but in my question for a new interface I was thinking about how nice it would be to record straight to an iPad (or hard disk) and then dump the raw audio into DP.