2018 Macbook Pro High Sierra - Digital Noise

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Discussion related to installation, configuration and use of MOTU hardware such as MIDI interfaces, audio interfaces, etc. for Mac OSX
renderful
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Joined: Thu Aug 02, 2012 11:15 am
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Re: 2018 Macbook Pro High Sierra - Digital Noise

Post by renderful »

I've also got an Ultralite Mk4 and 2018 Macbook Pro running Mojave. I had the Mk3 and it was flawless until Sierra. Then I had kernel panics caused by Firewire sleep issues in macOS.

So I upgraded to the Mk4.

Until a few days ago, I had a 2016 Macbook Pro with 10.12 on it. Had major issues with the Mk4 there, drop outs, mac can't detect device until rebooting device and mac, squealing noises, sync loss etc...

Problems persist on the Macbook Pro 2018 with the most recent Mojave.

I've tried the original USB cable with an Apple adapter, and I've tried a USB-B to USB-C cable. Same results on both.

Time to plunk down for an RME Fireface I guess?
txtfiles
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Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2018 4:47 am
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Re: 2018 Macbook Pro High Sierra - Digital Noise

Post by txtfiles »

Any news on this issue? I have the same problem. Motu Ultralite MK4 and Macbook Pro 2018
I spent almos 700 bucks on the Ultralite and this frustrates me. So please I need help!

Best from Berlin
K
renderful
Posts: 18
Joined: Thu Aug 02, 2012 11:15 am
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Re: 2018 Macbook Pro High Sierra - Digital Noise

Post by renderful »

I talked with a MOTU support person yesterday and he seemed to blame Apple's OS updates, but I've been having these issues since an early version of Sierra, so I am kind of doubting that, and even if it is Apple's fault MOTU should have it fixed considering that they posted this to the front of their website: http://motu.com/newsitems/motu-and-mac-os-mojave

His recommendations were that I try it with Sleep, Screensaver, Bluetooth and Wifi disabled. So I guess I need to try that in order to add to their debugging dataset so they can figure this out, however my computer is useless with those things disabled so it's kind of a silly test.
Ben1000
Posts: 10
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2018 7:37 pm
Primary DAW OS: MacOS

Re: 2018 Macbook Pro High Sierra - Digital Noise

Post by Ben1000 »

Howdy...

I just purchased an Ultralite Mk4, and a new 2018 13" MBP Touch Bar. I've been using the MBP and Mainstage with no issues for a couple of months with a Focusrite, but I wanted the extra outputs and mixing of the MOTU, so purchased that..

MBP is still running the High Sierra it came with.

However, I am noticing that after random intervals, I am getting digital distortion on the outputs, which can be fixed by toggling the 'computer volume' setting on the MOTU. Sometimes the output cuts off all together...

Very disconcerting. I hope there's a solution soon... :( :( :(

Best,

Ben
narcoleptica
Posts: 1
Joined: Fri Nov 30, 2018 11:38 am
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Re: 2018 Macbook Pro High Sierra - Digital Noise

Post by narcoleptica »

Hi there!

I have the same problem with my new MBP 2018 (Mojave v10.14.1) and my MOTU 4pre. I talked to the technical support but they gave me no solution... I spent a lot of money in a new laptop and I have to play live with my old MBP 2009 again because it's more reliable!! :(
Tonybert
Posts: 1
Joined: Tue Nov 20, 2018 8:56 am
Primary DAW OS: MacOS

Re: 2018 Macbook Pro High Sierra - Digital Noise

Post by Tonybert »

I have the same problem. Apple won't do anything about it. I posted this video on youtube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BfXRQ2IMs9w the problem can be triggered by switching location services on/off.

The video is with a FIREFACE UFX but I have the same one on a MOTU ultralite mk4. Loosing signal and getting digital noise.
renderful
Posts: 18
Joined: Thu Aug 02, 2012 11:15 am
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Re: 2018 Macbook Pro High Sierra - Digital Noise

Post by renderful »

Great info here regarding "Computer Volume" and "Location Services".

Those indeed temporarily fix and cause the audio drop out and sample rate issues for me, respectively.

Interesting to see that it's happening on the Fireface as well. I assume there will be some driver solutions for this, but we will need to get this info to MOTU tech support.
Last edited by renderful on Sun Dec 02, 2018 2:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
tcenguyen
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Joined: Sun Dec 02, 2018 11:48 am
Primary DAW OS: MacOS

Re: 2018 Macbook Pro High Sierra - Digital Noise

Post by tcenguyen »

I have the same problem with the new MacBook Pro 2018 and Ultralite AVB. Mojave 10.14
Distorted noise comes in after 15-30 minutes. I have tried to switch to different USB 2 the USB 3. Same problem. I have contacted Motu but no answer yet.
With the same hardware, same daw and configuration on my MacBook Pro 2014 Retina. No Problem and the Audio works fine no Distortion, No Drops Out or lost connection.
I hope Apple and Motu will work together and resolve the issue so I can utilize my MBP 2018.

Thanks for all the post here, I am not the only one with the Ultralite AVB problem, reading your posts helps.
tcenguyen
Posts: 2
Joined: Sun Dec 02, 2018 11:48 am
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Re: 2018 Macbook Pro High Sierra - Digital Noise

Post by tcenguyen »

With the uncertain fix at this time, I have found the link from Sweetwater that you guys might need to try. Hopefully, It will eliminate the issue for now. I have not tried it yet. I will when possible and I let the forum know.
https://www.sweetwater.com/sweetcare/ar ... es-on-mac/
renderful
Posts: 18
Joined: Thu Aug 02, 2012 11:15 am
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Re: 2018 Macbook Pro High Sierra - Digital Noise

Post by renderful »

RME having same issues as well FYI: https://www.forum.rme-audio.de/viewtopic.php?id=26881
Ben1000
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Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2018 7:37 pm
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Re: 2018 Macbook Pro High Sierra - Digital Noise

Post by Ben1000 »

Howdy... I'd like to post this interaction I had with MOTU support on this issue. This was my first time dealing with MOTU.. Be warned: I got a little frustrated towards the end... Probably should have kept my cool... :(

Best,

Ben

TRANSCRIPT FOLLOWS:

Howdy...

I just purchased an Ultralite Mk4, and a new 2018 13" MBP Touch Bar. I've been using the MBP and Mainstage with no issues for a couple of months with a Focusrite, but I wanted the extra outputs and mixing of the MOTU, so purchased that..

MBP is still running the High Sierra it came with.

However, I am noticing that after random intervals, I am getting digital distortion on the outputs, which can be fixed by toggling the 'computer volume' setting on the MOTU. Sometimes the output cuts off all together...

I've tried reinstalling everything, tried turning off every other think like wifi and bluetooth. Tried different sample rates and clocks, etc... Nothing helps overcome this random noise and cut offs, which make this unuseable... :(

Can you suggest a course of action?

Responses
Added by Andrew on 2018/12/04 15:41:56 Universal
Attached file: http://techlink-attachments.motu.com/ti ... 17076/MOTU Pro Audio troubleshooting macOS.pdf
State change from 'Awaiting reply' to 'In progress'
Hi Ben,

Thanks for writing.

I'd recommend taking a look at the attached troubleshooting guide for the UltraLite mk4. Specifically, I recommend taking a look at step number 8 and 9.

Additionally, if you leave the Computer Volume controls set to off, does the distortion issue still happen?

Best,
Andrew
Added by Andrew on 2018/12/04 15:43:37 Universal
Last edited by Andrew on 2018/12/04 15:43:50 Universal
Attached file: http://techlink-attachments.motu.com/ti ... 17076/MOTU Pro Audio troubleshooting macOS.pdf (1)
Added by BENJAMIN on 2018/12/04 17:07:33 Universal
Thank you. In regards to this... Point 8... If I run the unit in class compliant mode, will this not disable some of the functionality of the unit?

Point 9... This is a brand new MBP, and I have never used Digidesign or any AVID software. The only thing installed is APPLE Logic/Mainstage and your interface. This is a dedicated computer for my music purposes.

Distortion and cut offs happen no matter what the computer volume is set to, however I do that toggling this setting brings things back to life for a short periord. Same with sample rate. It seems like this 'resets' the connection to the computer and makes it work for a short while thereafter, but the problem soon returns.

What would you suggest I try next?

Best,

Ben
Added by Andrew on 2018/12/04 17:24:07 Universal
State change from 'Awaiting reply' to 'In progress'
Hi Ben,

It's true that the USB class compliant will not let you access the MOTU Discovery App. So yes, the device's functionality will be slightly limited in this mode. However, you can still use the presets menu via the front panel to change the settings of the unit. Also, USB class compliant mode only allows 24 channels.

I suspect that using the USB class driver may resolve the distortion. However, I am aware that this isn't an ideal solution for everyone. Please keep me posted and I will be sure to help you out with this.

Best,
Andrew


Added by Andrew on 2018/12/04 21:47:50 Universal
Hi Ben,

Please do and keep me posted. We are working on driver updates so please be sure to keep an eye open in the MOTU Discovery App for updates.

Best,
Andrew

Added by BENJAMIN on 2018/12/05 20:54:39 Universal
Howdy...

How do I access the Pro Audio Control webapp without the discovery app?

Thanks.

Ben
Added by Andrew on 2018/12/05 23:49:26 Universal
Hi Ben,

With the UltraLite mk4, you can access the MOTU web app by opening your browser and typing 'localhost:1280' in the address bar. However, keep in mind that this will only work when you have installed the MOTU Pro Audio installer and have not removed the MOTUProAudio.kext from the extensions folder. If you are running the UltraLite mk4 via the USB class driver, then you will not be able to use the MOTU Discovery app or web app.

Best,
Andrew
Added by BENJAMIN on 2018/12/05 23:52:37 Universal
Howdy...

So, just to clarify... When you said "So yes, the device's functionality will be slightly limited in this mode."

... by slightly limited, you meant ZERO functionality except for a basic computer audio interface?

Really? Is that what you meant by slightly limited?

Best,

Ben

Added by Andrew on 2018/12/06 00:54:45 Universal
Hi Ben,

I suppose it really depends on the use case. For users who want realtime control of the UltraLite's mixer, then USB class complaint is not an ideal solution as you cannot access the web app with this driver. For users who merely use the UltraLite as an I/O box for their computer or users who like to direct monitor in addition to the I/O without a need for live mixing control, USB class compliant is a solution.

Best,
Andrew
Edit
Added by BENJAMIN on 2018/12/06 01:04:34 Universal
Not really a solution, but perhaps a stop-gap. If your use case is a door-stop, you don't even need to hook up the power supply.

May I suggest you'll have happier customers if don't over-promise on workaround or solutions. Class Compliant means customers are not getting the device they paid for no matter what their use case, and there's no use case where disabling the drivers could be considered 'slightly limited' functionality.

I guess since the unit just doesn't work with the current MBPs and current drivers, I'll have to join the rest of the people on the forum in hoping that you have a new driver to fix this issue soon.

Ben.
renderful
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Re: 2018 Macbook Pro High Sierra - Digital Noise

Post by renderful »

I solved all of my issues, by buying one of these: https://www.amazon.com/CalDigit-Thunder ... C63BC&th=1

and running the Ultralite Mk4 through the USB port on that, which puts it on the Dock's USB controller, rather than the internal USB controllers of my Macbook Pro 2018.

I did this based on similar reports from RME users, and an RME engineer's recommendation here: https://www.forum.rme-audio.de/viewtopi ... 66#p136666
renderful
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Re: 2018 Macbook Pro High Sierra - Digital Noise

Post by renderful »

New reply from MOTU Support: "Yes, we've seen improvements with Thunderbolt docks as a "buffer". And yes, other users across different manufacturers are experiencing similar symptoms. We believe this to be an Apple Core Audio bug.

It's more prevalent over USB, but we've seen it on Thunderbolt as well. So hopefully this fixes it for you for now. Feel free to keep this ticket open and we can share any additional information or updates with each other when the time comes."
oratowsky
Posts: 2
Joined: Sat Feb 16, 2019 4:11 pm
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Re: 2018 Macbook Pro High Sierra - Digital Noise

Post by oratowsky »

Hi guys,

I wanted to chime in and say I have the exact same issues you all describe with my 2017 macbook pro and my ultralite mk4.

Been through all the same troubleshooting with Motu, been told it's Apple's problem, etc. I've been dealing with this for a year and a half. Initially I thought it was an Apple problem and they replaced my logic board twice, then the whole computer. Then I saw the issues occur on the brand new one and realized it must be the ultralite.

The last I told them I said i've been troubleshooting this with them for way too long with no resolution. They say it's Apple's problem, but there are clearly other audio interfaces on the market that work on mac.

I can understand in the weeks that follow an OS update or a new product, there are kinks to be worked out, but this is far too long. It's surprising that such a large brand like MOTU allows this to go on for so long.

I asked them to either work with the retailer to refund me or send me an older generation MOTU product that might not have this issue. That was last week, and they were sympathetic on the phone, but like so many times before, they just never followed up.

Using it in class compliant mode makes the dropouts and distortions less frequent, but I still have issues even when I trash the motu driver.

I don't know what to do. MOTU support seems pretty bad. I can't sell it in good faith. I think I'm just out $600. I guess if they send me one of these port adapters that solve it, that would be OK, but still so inelegant and crazy from a major pro audio brand. Are there consumer protection laws that apply at this point?
renderful
Posts: 18
Joined: Thu Aug 02, 2012 11:15 am
Primary DAW OS: Unspecified

Re: 2018 Macbook Pro High Sierra - Digital Noise

Post by renderful »

I believe this is absolutely an Apple problem. This is effecting RME interfaces as well:

https://www.forum.rme-audio.de/viewtopic.php?id=26881
https://www.forum.rme-audio.de/viewtopi ... 66#p136666

The new 2018 Macbook Pros and Mac Minis have even more issues:
https://appleinsider.com/articles/19/02 ... face-users
http://cdm.link/2019/02/apple-2018-glitch/
https://ask.audio/articles/is-apples-t2 ... recordings

I bought the Caldigit Mini Dock and stopped thinking about the issues
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