MIDI Express XT stops working after a few hours of non-use

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Discussion related to installation, configuration and use of MOTU hardware such as MIDI interfaces, audio interfaces, etc. for Mac OSX
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dhjdhj
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MIDI Express XT stops working after a few hours of non-use

Post by dhjdhj »

I have run into a problem where, if I leave my system (Mac laptop running 10.9.1) alone for a few hours and then come back to it, I find that MIDI no longer works.

At that point, I can run the Snoize MIDI Monitor and click the RESCAN menu item and MIDI will start working again perfectly.

MOTU tech support says they've never heard of this problem (I first reported it over a year ago) but nevertheless it is happening.

I have one of the newer XTs (i.e, from the re-release in 2011).

Anyone have any idea what might be going on?

Thanks,
D
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David Jameson, Ph.D.
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Macbook Pro (2) running GigPerformer, Max 7 and Loopback, iPad (3), various weighted and lightweight MIDI controllers, Eigenharp Alpha, plugins from NI, AAS, Arturia, Modartt, G-Force and many others

Currently performing with The Security Project (http://securityprojectband.com) and Beyond The Wall (http://beyondthewall.net)
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mikehalloran
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Re: MIDI Express XT stops working after a few hours of non-u

Post by mikehalloran »

It's a really good idea to let us know your setup. That's why we have it in our signatures.

So, without having a clue as to what the issue might be, I will throw in the usual first suggestion: Replace the internal C-2032 battery. Three years is not too soon.

This fixes a lot of weird little issues if the old one is weak. Worst case: at least you will know that you are not trying to chase an issue caused by a weak battery. Best case: that's the problem.
DP 11.31; 828mkII FW, micro lite, M4, MTP/AV USB Firmware 2.0.1
2023 Mac Studio M2 8TB, 192GB RAM, OS Sonoma 14.4, USB4 8TB external, M-Audio AIR 192|14, Mackie ProFxv3 6/10/12; 2012 MBPs Catalina, Mojave
IK-NI-Izotope-PSP-Garritan-Antares, LogicPro X, Finale 27.4, Dorico 5.2, Notion 6, Overture 5, TwistedWave, DSP-Q 5, SmartScore64 Pro, Toast 20 Pro
dhjdhj
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Re: MIDI Express XT stops working after a few hours of non-u

Post by dhjdhj »

Fair enough, I've updated my profile. The Express NTs are not that old but I didn't realize they needed batteries. I assumed that routings and mappings etc. were stored in non-volatile memory. What's the purpose of the battery?
I'll get new batteries tomorrow and test again. I appreciate the feedback.
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David Jameson, Ph.D.
http://www.deskew.com

Macbook Pro (2) running GigPerformer, Max 7 and Loopback, iPad (3), various weighted and lightweight MIDI controllers, Eigenharp Alpha, plugins from NI, AAS, Arturia, Modartt, G-Force and many others

Currently performing with The Security Project (http://securityprojectband.com) and Beyond The Wall (http://beyondthewall.net)
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mikehalloran
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Re: MIDI Express XT stops working after a few hours of non-u

Post by mikehalloran »

It's a 'keep alive' battery for the memory. Except for the Fast Lane, most other MOTU MIDI devices do.

More than once we get reports on these boards along the line of, "it shouldn't be the battery - my settings are still being stored..." and then, later, "hey, replacing the battery worked". This is why it's normally the first suggestion - somewhere before it goes bad enough to lose the settings, a weak battery can cause these to misbehave.

The MTPII, MTP-AV, MIDI Express, Micro Express and Express XT use a battery to back up user settings or save the last state the device was in before powering off. If your interface looses these settings, you can replace the battery. The battery is a standard lithium long life watch battery. To replace it, remove the side screws to lift the top cover of the interface. View the circuit board. In the center is a clip casing. Most likely the word Lithium or CR-2032 is written on the battery. Carefully remove the battery from the clip and replace. Most electronics or watch stores carry this battery.
DP 11.31; 828mkII FW, micro lite, M4, MTP/AV USB Firmware 2.0.1
2023 Mac Studio M2 8TB, 192GB RAM, OS Sonoma 14.4, USB4 8TB external, M-Audio AIR 192|14, Mackie ProFxv3 6/10/12; 2012 MBPs Catalina, Mojave
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dhjdhj
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Re: MIDI Express XT stops working after a few hours of non-u

Post by dhjdhj »

Yeah, the fun part will be taking it out of the travel rack, disconnecting all the cables in a tiny space, etc
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David Jameson, Ph.D.
http://www.deskew.com

Macbook Pro (2) running GigPerformer, Max 7 and Loopback, iPad (3), various weighted and lightweight MIDI controllers, Eigenharp Alpha, plugins from NI, AAS, Arturia, Modartt, G-Force and many others

Currently performing with The Security Project (http://securityprojectband.com) and Beyond The Wall (http://beyondthewall.net)
dhjdhj
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Re: MIDI Express XT stops working after a few hours of non-u

Post by dhjdhj »

What is the "Intel Upgrade chip" you mention as part of your Time Piece?
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David Jameson, Ph.D.
http://www.deskew.com

Macbook Pro (2) running GigPerformer, Max 7 and Loopback, iPad (3), various weighted and lightweight MIDI controllers, Eigenharp Alpha, plugins from NI, AAS, Arturia, Modartt, G-Force and many others

Currently performing with The Security Project (http://securityprojectband.com) and Beyond The Wall (http://beyondthewall.net)
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mikehalloran
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Re: MIDI Express XT stops working after a few hours of non-u

Post by mikehalloran »

dhjdhj wrote:What is the "Intel Upgrade chip" you mention as part of your Time Piece?
Older MOTU MIDI interfaces aren't compatible with intel Macs. MOTU sold a $24.95 chip set to fix this. It's no longer listed on the MOTU site. For those who still need them, you have to call MOTU to check availability. It was still listed on MOTU in 2012 when I bought mine. I changed the CR2032 battery in mine while I had the cover off, as long as I was there, of course.

If this was your issue, your XT would not work at all with any Intel Mac. I believe that all XTs with removable rack ears have the later chip sets. In any case, any made in 2007 or later are compatible.

I cannot find this on MOTU.com anymore but here it is:

"This ROM update allows certain older MOTU USB MIDI interfaces to operate successfully with PCs or Macs with Intel Processors.

If you are using the Micro Lite or Express 128, or a MIDI Express XT or Micro Express with removable rack ears, your interface already has this latest ROM version and you do not need to purchase this ROM update.

If you have another MOTU MIDI interface model, check the printed label on the bottom of the unit. If "M/W" is printed on the label, then your interface already has this latest ROM version and you do not need to purchase this ROM update.

If the label does NOT have "M/W" printed on it, then you need this ROM update to successfully operate your interface with an Intel PC or Mac."


Anyway, your issue could be the battery. I paid $3.75 for some today - my Ford and Toyota key fobs take them also. There are less expensive ones out there but some of my medical equipment says to use Duracell or Eveready only so I pay the big buck$. There have been reports on these boards that some of the generic brands don't last as long. Since you have indicated that pulling the unit will be a pain (changing a Toyota key fob one handed is, too), you might not want to buy an el cheapo generic. Just a suggestion.

Getting the battery out of the holder is a little tricky. Press down and you can get it to slide over and tilt up. Replacing is easy once you see how.
DP 11.31; 828mkII FW, micro lite, M4, MTP/AV USB Firmware 2.0.1
2023 Mac Studio M2 8TB, 192GB RAM, OS Sonoma 14.4, USB4 8TB external, M-Audio AIR 192|14, Mackie ProFxv3 6/10/12; 2012 MBPs Catalina, Mojave
IK-NI-Izotope-PSP-Garritan-Antares, LogicPro X, Finale 27.4, Dorico 5.2, Notion 6, Overture 5, TwistedWave, DSP-Q 5, SmartScore64 Pro, Toast 20 Pro
dhjdhj
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Re: MIDI Express XT stops working after a few hours of non-u

Post by dhjdhj »

Sigh, there are no "side" screws on my Express XT. There are rackears (allan screws) and philips screws on the top and bottom

Time to call MOTU
___________________
David Jameson, Ph.D.
http://www.deskew.com

Macbook Pro (2) running GigPerformer, Max 7 and Loopback, iPad (3), various weighted and lightweight MIDI controllers, Eigenharp Alpha, plugins from NI, AAS, Arturia, Modartt, G-Force and many others

Currently performing with The Security Project (http://securityprojectband.com) and Beyond The Wall (http://beyondthewall.net)
dhjdhj
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Re: MIDI Express XT stops working after a few hours of non-u

Post by dhjdhj »

Well, that was a complete waste of time.

There is no battery in a modern Express NT.
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David Jameson, Ph.D.
http://www.deskew.com

Macbook Pro (2) running GigPerformer, Max 7 and Loopback, iPad (3), various weighted and lightweight MIDI controllers, Eigenharp Alpha, plugins from NI, AAS, Arturia, Modartt, G-Force and many others

Currently performing with The Security Project (http://securityprojectband.com) and Beyond The Wall (http://beyondthewall.net)
dhjdhj
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Re: MIDI Express XT stops working after a few hours of non-u

Post by dhjdhj »

I'm still running into this problem --- note that it started when I first installed Mavericks. I'm wondering if this issue is related to the new App Nap feature in Mavericks?

SOMETHING is causing CoreMIDI to go to sleep after a period of inactivity. It can be revived by reinitializing CoreMIDI from a simple application (I basically wrote a program that essentially just says
MIDIRestart();

Anyone else seen this?
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David Jameson, Ph.D.
http://www.deskew.com

Macbook Pro (2) running GigPerformer, Max 7 and Loopback, iPad (3), various weighted and lightweight MIDI controllers, Eigenharp Alpha, plugins from NI, AAS, Arturia, Modartt, G-Force and many others

Currently performing with The Security Project (http://securityprojectband.com) and Beyond The Wall (http://beyondthewall.net)
jmc44jmc
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Re: MIDI Express XT stops working after a few hours of non-u

Post by jmc44jmc »

I'll be running with the same setup, so if nothing else I will let you know if the same thing happens for me.
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