New Finale

[Elektroakoustika]

I guess I'm on Finale forever. So essentially what that means is Dorito [sic] is NOT capable of engraving. For truly serious composers, arrangers, orchestrators, and publishers, that is patently untenable. I have no interest whatsoever in "auto-parts."

Look at my post above about Dorico and part-editing. I think Dorico is aimed at serious composers, arrangers, orchestrators, and publishers. From the video I posted, it looks like you can add master parameters that are applied to all parts, but then can go into individual parts and edit them to your heart's content.

I'm sure if you asked on the Dorico forum, they would confirm that part editing is completely possible (and from my impression of the video I posted, very intuitive).

The only big downside I see in Dorico's first release thus far, is that Daniel said there won't be large time-signatures for scores in the first release, but it is planned for a future update. This is something I use in my larger scores all the time.

As for chord names and lead sheets, I still think the first release is aimed solely at the classical demographic. I'm sure they'll add features for those who work in the jazz/pop/rock areas later on, but my sense is that they want to get their foot in the door with classical composers, arrangers, and publishers first.

Neither Finale or Sibelius started off being able to do everything on their first releases. I just think that Dorico is the first program I've seen that could, eventually, knock those two programs off the top.

[Phil O]

He's simply "reviewing" the initial announcement of the program and is interpreting "extracting parts" as "editing parts," which are not one in the same.

Yeah, I was wondering about that. I still think, though, that for the way I use notation software, Dorico is a few years away from what I need. In the meantime, the question is what to do about Finale.

[mikehalloran]

2014.5 is pretty good. A new build was released recently that fixed a number of problems.

If you don't have 2014, you can always call MakeMusic and ask if they will let you authorize a copy if you purchase the upgrade to 25. I have always found them very accommodating in that way—when I had my last church job, I needed to authorize my license on four Macs and they let me.

If you do have 2014, download 25 and put it through its paces. The only thing you don't get are the new Garritan sounds. You can also purchase 25 and exercise the 30 day refund period if need be.

I am on the fence about asking for a refund but probably will not do so. My deal breaker issues were addressed even if I don't like the resolution. If I need the movie window and .tiff scanning, 2014.5 lets me do that. There will be other issues, no doubt, but the fact that I can open 25 files in 2014.5 mitigates that some. Phone support is responsive.

[MIDI Life Crisis]

Unfortunately for me the two deal breakers are the movie window and tiff import to OCR. Those are my most used features. I scan a fair amount of period PD music and otherwise spend 90%-ish of my time scoring to picture when in Finale. Dorito [sic] is clearly not part of my toolbox for a long time, and S., never.

[Phil O]

Just spent a couple hours fiddling with F25 demo. I'm ready to do things you only see in the movies.

My audio setup is a little weird and ALL audio goes through DP, even if I'm just watching a Youtube video. To accomplish this some audio is routed through an old 828 via light pipe. The system has worked great, but to fool Finale into selecting the correct channels 9-10 on the 828 I had to set up an aggregate device. It works in 2014.5 but F25 won't let me do it.

That and random freezes/crashes, some of the old annoying bugs still there, and a host of other annoying ••••. I honestly don't know if I'll upgrade.

Phil

[Phil O]

Just got a reply on my ticket regarding audio out from Finale. Here an excerpt:

"Thanks for providing me with that additional information. Finale doesn't offer any advanced output parameters to change, and in fact it is downstream from the connection between your interface and your operating system. That is to say, Finale depends on that connection to function properly and output sound."

I honestly don't know WTF that means, but I'm done pursuing it. Advanced output parameters? Really? I just want it to send a signal to an aggregate device. All my other apps can do it. Finder, Quicktime, Safari, Firefox, to name a few. I've found some workarounds - but I really think Finale is getting dumbed down. JMHO.

Phil

[MIDI Life Crisis]

As far as I can see, it's the end of the line for Finale in a pro studio, especially scoring to picture. F 2014.5 it was he last gasp unless things change dramatically over there. F25 is supposed to output sound via Rewire to a DAW and you're supposed to watch the picture in the DAWs movie window. Huh?

Problem one is it doesn't work. I can see the signal arriving as an "instrument" in DP but can't get to the instrument to assign it to and output. Whaaaaa?

It looses the connection entirely every time. But what a PITA having to run two programs and jump back and forth to work on the score. The dumbest thing I've ever seen a software developer do. It was working fine. Leave it alone (at the very least)!

Nah. My Finale days are over. That's sad. I like the prog and was a featured artist on their website twinge (1996 and 2011). I'll keep F2014.5 until I have to move on - one way or another. Lol.

[Phil O]

Yeah, I hear you. I can use rewire as well to get things to route through DP, but Finale only works as a slave in Rewire, which means you have to use DP's transport to trigger playback in Finale (major PIA). I can only imagine how adding a movie window to that scenario augments the PIA factor.

These aren't the solutions you're looking for. You can go about your business. Move along.

Phil

[mikehalloran]

Finale 25.1 is out:

http://www.musicxml.com/finale-v25-1-musicxml-updates/

[MIDI Life Crisis]

Zzzzzzzzzzz..........

[Phil O]

If I read this correctly, it looks like they have addressed the Rewire master/slave issue. I may just give this release another look.

Phil

[MIDI Life Crisis]

Even with that fixed, you'll still need to run two apps and switch back and forth to see the sync'd score with picture. Maybe Apple is charging to license QuickTime technology? MOTU also dropped QT but didn't depend on some external app to keep me VIs functions. They redesigned the feature from the ground up. I didn't like it as much, but they didn't ditch those working to picture. MakeMusic (I call them Make Mistakes) simple "outsourced" the feature. That would be like Photoshop making you use Preview if you want to see your work in color.

For most (all?) film folks scoring directly to picture, F2014.5 is the end of the line.

[mhschmieder]

Got my eyes on Dorico (Steinberg) at this point. Out of the gate, it isn't enough, but let's see how quickly the app grows. Seems to have a good overall workflow to it, like Notion and Encore.

[mikehalloran]

Got my eyes on Dorico (Steinberg) at this point. Out of the gate, it isn't enough, but let's see how quickly the app grows. Seems to have a good overall workflow to it, like Notion and Encore.

Dorico is definitely not ready for prime time but it may live up to the hype eventually or not...

I pulled the trigger on Overture 5 for the crossgrade price yesterday. It's about 95% there. Don wrote Encore and Overture has a lot of that "feel" to it which I like for note and lyric entry. I'll use MusicXML to export to Finale for final layout if that's important. At least Overture supports XML 3, unlike Encore which is still frozen at MusicXML 1.3.

[MIDI Life Crisis]

No movie in Dorito either. Grrrr....