I don't even have a good title for this

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billf
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Re: I don't even have a good title for this

Post by billf »

Michael Canavan wrote:there is a definite curve where a genre is good or even great at the beginning, but once the style becomes completely standardized, it becomes a formula and only the part of your brain interested in 'comfort food, mindless TV etc.' can appreciate it.
It's mostly become consumable, disposable, and forgettable "product." Can you envision any of the modern pop music being produced now (especially country) being remembered thirty years now? Is the name Blake Shelton likely to be revered in fifty years as the name Jimi Hendrix or Johnny Cash is today?
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Re: I don't even have a good title for this

Post by BKK-OZ »

Tritonemusic wrote:
philbrown wrote:'smooth jazz'
That is one of the lamest terms I've ever heard. I've yet to hear "Smooth Jazz" that sounds anything like real jazz.
Kind of Blue, pretty smooth, pretty jazzy.
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…string theory says that all subatomic particles of the universe are nothing but musical notes. A, B-flat, C-sharp, correspond to electrons, neutrinos, quarks, and what have you. Therefore, physics is nothing but the laws of harmony of these strings. Chemistry is nothing but the melodies we can play on these strings. The universe is a symphony of strings and the mind of God… it is cosmic music resonating through 11 dimensional hyperspace.
- M Kaku
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Re: I don't even have a good title for this

Post by Tritonemusic »

BKK-OZ wrote:
Tritonemusic wrote:
philbrown wrote:'smooth jazz'
That is one of the lamest terms I've ever heard. I've yet to hear "Smooth Jazz" that sounds anything like real jazz.
Kind of Blue, pretty smooth, pretty jazzy.
"Kind Of Blue" is a masterpiece. And, it is jazz. To lump it in with the modern term "Smooth Jazz" is just ridiculous. I've never heard anyone say that album is "Smooth Jazz." LOL!

I think if Miles heard someone calling it that, he'd be rolling in his grave.

By the way, BKK, if you were serious, I didn't mean to sound insulting. It's just how I feel about that term.
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monkey man
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Re: I don't even have a good title for this

Post by monkey man »

philbrown wrote:... I think I would mind it less if they would just name it something beside 'country'...
I'm so with you on this, Phil. IMHO, it's an insult to all those hard-working folk who genuinely endeavour to produce "real" country.
Tritonemusic wrote:
philbrown wrote:'smooth jazz'
That is one of the lamest terms I've ever heard. I've yet to hear "Smooth Jazz" that sounds anything like real jazz.
Exactly. "Elevator / Corporate Answering service Muzak" might be more apt descriptions. It sounds to me like the peeps who perform that stuff are failed wannabe jazz musos. Apologies to anyone here on the 'Nation who produces the stuff with the best of intentions, of course.
Michael Canavan wrote:there is a definite curve where a genre is good or even great at the beginning, but once the style becomes completely standardized, it becomes a formula and only the part of your brain interested in 'comfort food, mindless TV etc.' can appreciate it.
So true, Michael, and sad of course.
Billy-Boy wrote:It's mostly become consumable, disposable, and forgettable "product." Can you envision any of the modern pop music being produced now (especially country) being remembered thirty years now? Is the name Blake Shelton likely to be revered in fifty years as the name Jimi Hendrix or Johnny Cash is today?
Nooooo!
Tritonemusic wrote:"Kind Of Blue" is a masterpiece. And, it is jazz. To lump it in with the modern term "Smooth Jazz" is just ridiculous. I've never heard anyone say that album is "Smooth Jazz." LOL!

I think if Miles heard someone calling it that, he'd be rolling in his grave.

By the way, BKK, if you were serious, I didn't mean to sound insulting. It's just how I feel about that term.
Agreed 100%, Rads. It's a damned masterpiece. It wouldn't have become a standard otherwise.

Go Miles! You can quit rolling now, buddy...

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Re: I don't even have a good title for this

Post by BKK-OZ »

Tritonemusic wrote:"Kind Of Blue" is a masterpiece. And, it is jazz. To lump it in with the modern term "Smooth Jazz" is just ridiculous. I've never heard anyone say that album is "Smooth Jazz." LOL!

I think if Miles heard someone calling it that, he'd be rolling in his grave.

By the way, BKK, if you were serious, I didn't mean to sound insulting. It's just how I feel about that term.
Well, I was serious, but not insulted in the least.

I know what you mean when you say that most people would identify the phrase 'smooth jazz' with Kenny G or similar, but I often don't like it when a phrase gets co-opted like that. And I often don't buy into that either.

Not trying to make a political point here, but by way of example, the phrase 'politically correct' is often used as an insult. But I tend to think, well what is wrong with being correct? A better example might be 'economic rationalist'. When confronted with that label as a put-down, years ago one of our former prime ministers here in Oz once retorted, 'what, would you rather have irrational economics'?

So, to me, smooth jazz isn't Kenny G, or whatever people might want to pigeon-hole it as. It is just jazz that is smooth-n-cool, as in like the birth of the cool that Kind of Blue represents.

Now, if you really wanted to insult me, you would remind me that GB lost in tragic circumstances on Sunday.
Cheers,
BK

…string theory says that all subatomic particles of the universe are nothing but musical notes. A, B-flat, C-sharp, correspond to electrons, neutrinos, quarks, and what have you. Therefore, physics is nothing but the laws of harmony of these strings. Chemistry is nothing but the melodies we can play on these strings. The universe is a symphony of strings and the mind of God… it is cosmic music resonating through 11 dimensional hyperspace.
- M Kaku
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Re: I don't even have a good title for this

Post by monkey man »

I hear you, Adrian, but... Smooth Jazz is now a genre.

EDIT: Oops, sorry BK; I thought it was Bolla talkin!

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Re: I don't even have a good title for this

Post by BKK-OZ »

monkey man wrote:I hear you, Adrian, but... Smooth Jazz is now a genre.

EDIT: Oops, sorry BK; I thought it was Bolla talkin!
I don't believe in genres, always hated categories in record stores, pretty meaningless to me. Muzak is a brand - I can accept that. Sometimes these sorts of labels are convenient, more often than not they just get in the way of appreciating the work.

For example, is KD Lang a country, jazz or ??? musician? (I just think she is a good one.) Even Lady Gaga is singing with Tony Bennett now - does that mean she is no longer a pop star?

Like the man said, there are only two kinds of music - good and bad.

When I am asked what kind of music I make, I always say 'dangerous, modern music'. Shuts 'em right up.
Cheers,
BK

…string theory says that all subatomic particles of the universe are nothing but musical notes. A, B-flat, C-sharp, correspond to electrons, neutrinos, quarks, and what have you. Therefore, physics is nothing but the laws of harmony of these strings. Chemistry is nothing but the melodies we can play on these strings. The universe is a symphony of strings and the mind of God… it is cosmic music resonating through 11 dimensional hyperspace.
- M Kaku
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monkey man
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Re: I don't even have a good title for this

Post by monkey man »

Ha ha!

I agree with you, BK. The only music I've written and recorded so far defies categorisation, especially if it were all included on one album. Sure, there's "rocky", "dancey" and "funky" stuff, but those terms are only approximations.

I was simply stating the fact that smooth jazz is now recognised as a genre; there's a plethora of artists out there who describe themselves thusly and who indeed adhere strictly to its (the "genre's") framework / limitations. I pity them, but hey, it's recognised.

Probably worth noting that this isn't what we've come to know as "elevator muzak". IMHO, the latter includes smooth jazz, but it can just as easily be low-budget MIDI mock-ups of popular music in the funk, pop, rock (p-lease!) or country "genres". When I think of elevator muzak, I no longer think of Kenny G, but instead of toons that wouldn't have a hope of selling in any other market.

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Re: I don't even have a good title for this

Post by SixStringGeek »

monkey man wrote:I hear you, Adrian, but... Smooth Jazz is now a genre.
Chuck Mangione and Kenny G have a lot to answer for. 8)
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Re: I don't even have a good title for this

Post by monkey man »

Aaw... Chuck was cool though.

I used to listen to "Feels So Good" or whatever it's called quite a lot. I really liked his bass and sax players. Great vibe on that album.

I realise, of course, that you're only kidding, Geekster. Maybe not about Kenny G, but kidding nevertheless. :lol:

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Re: I don't even have a good title for this

Post by SixStringGeek »

monkey man wrote:Aaw... Chuck was cool though.
I saw him live in 1982 at the cow palace in Albuquerque. He puts on an excellent show. :D
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Re: I don't even have a good title for this

Post by monkey man »

I'll bet! Lucky you.

Same lineup as the "Feels So Good" album? I just remembered that (I think) Grant Geissman played on that one too...

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