MasterWriter 3 Released

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SixStringGeek
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MasterWriter 3 Released

Post by SixStringGeek »

And I'm not too pleased with it. What is not at all clear from the offer letter for upgrade is that it is now a web app - you have to have an internet connection to use it. So, dashing off to the beach with a guitar and a laptop is no longer an option. I did not learn this before paying for a two year license. Had I known, I would have passed.

To make matters worse, I hadn't realized that you, in fact, *rent* MW and it requires annual license renewal. Should you fail to renew - it holds all your songs hostage. Not so pleased about that.

I will be exporting all my material now that I have reverse engineered their backup file structure.

I cannot recommend its continued use.
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Re: MasterWriter 3 Released

Post by James Steele »

That does not sound good at all. I read this topic thinking I might get off the fence and look at it again. Not now.
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Re: MasterWriter 3 Released

Post by mhschmieder »

Adobe is taking the same approach. I have participated in two of their surveys where I pointed out various reasons -- including the one in the original post -- why the cloud (as they now call this ancient technology and approach) is not a good solution for a number of contexts and users.

Each of these companies acts like their product is the center of everyone's universe, when in fact most of us (on this forum at least) have many dedicated apps that we need either in off-line use or irregularly and cannot afford to pay for monthly or annually. Multiply by hundreds of apps and plug-ins and you'd have to be a millionaire.

But of course the bigger issue is the trend towards having to be on-line to use an app. When I'm running a session, I try to be as off-line as possible, and when doing a remote session, it's a given.

Thanks for the heads-up; I will avoid this product update (I keep getting email reminders about it).
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Re: MasterWriter 3 Released

Post by James Steele »

mhschmieder wrote:Adobe is taking the same approach. I have participated in two of their surveys where I pointed out various reasons -- including the one in the original post -- why the cloud (as they now call this ancient technology and approach) is not a good solution for a number of contexts and users.

Each of these companies acts like their product is the center of everyone's universe, when in fact most of us (on this forum at least) have many dedicated apps that we need either in off-line use or irregularly and cannot afford to pay for monthly or annually. Multiply by hundreds of apps and plug-ins and you'd have to be a millionaire.

But of course the bigger issue is the trend towards having to be on-line to use an app. When I'm running a session, I try to be as off-line as possible, and when doing a remote session, it's a given.

Thanks for the heads-up; I will avoid this product update (I keep getting email reminders about it).
You're preaching to the choir here. I have Adobe Photoshop Elements which is fine for my needs. I wanted to find some sort of desktop publishing app and ended up thinking I'd see what Adobe had these days. Maybe a dumbed-down "Elements" sort app. I can't remember now the name of what it is. I was a big Pagemaker fan back in the day. Anyway, I go to Adobe's website and I see all this stuff about signing up for a monthly plan to use the software and I was confused and frankly, annoyed. I don't like that whole scenario. I want to buy my app... especially as you pointed out when I might use it infrequently and don't want to be on this sort of subscription model.

Finally it drove me to something cheaper but that does the trick for my modest needs: Swift Publisher 3. It's a little rough around the edges, but I've come up with workarounds, all because there's no visceral satisfaction about "renting" your app. I want to know I can install it on my computer and it damn well works. The cloud is a nice place for my calendar and address book contacts. I don't want to rely on it for apps. My 2 cents. :)
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Re: MasterWriter 3 Released

Post by mikehalloran »

Microsoft tried this with XP and that didn't fly. Well, after Adobe had some success with CS 6, Microsoft is trying it again with Office 365. Pass...

MasterWriter 3 offers no features that I need. The annual license fee has kept me from even downloading the demo. That it is now a web app is an absolute deal killer for me. I like being able to sync documents between my devices but the idea that I need to be on the web to do any work at all... Wireless still isn't good enough for that.

What I am hoping is that they will still support the license manager for MW 2. If they don't and you have to move your copy to another computer or restore from backup, it won't work anymore.

I like MasterWriter but it is not as essential to the process that Barry thinks it is. I wrote songs for 30 years with pen and paper, ya know?
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Re: MasterWriter 3 Released

Post by Thomas.B. »

I can only recommend MasterWriter's main competitor Rhyme Genie. It comes with TuneSmith which you can install on as many computers as you wish and pretty much blows MasterWriter out of the water. The only downside is that you will have to transfer all your info from MasterWriter which can take a while. When I opened my old MasterWriter backup file in a text editor my lyrics where in an encrypted format. :(

At least MasterWriter 2 still allows you to export you songs. On MasterWriter's Facebook page users are being told that the export of audio files is not supported in MasterWriter 3. Why anyone would think that it is preferable to record and listen to large audio files over the internet is another matter. Especially since unlimited data plans for mobile devices are being phased out.
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Re: MasterWriter 3 Released

Post by mikehalloran »

When I opened my old MasterWriter backup file in a text editor my lyrics where in an encrypted format. :(
There's always copy and paste.
I can only recommend MasterWriter's main competitor Rhyme Genie. It comes with TuneSmith which you can install on as many computers as you wish and pretty much blows MasterWriter out of the water.
Really? How? MasterWriter has a number of features that don't exist in Rhyme Genie. - and vise versa. At $24.95, it's certainly a bargain and definitely a nice compliment to MW. I see nothing that "blows MasterWriter out of the water". Of course, now that MW 3's new implementation and licensing scheme blows... Anyway, thanks for the heads up. I'm going to buy a copy.
http://www.rhymegenie.com/

I will also let Barry and crew know what I think about making MW a web only app. Yech!

I have never used the audio functionality in MW. I've too many other programs including DP for that.

This is interesting:

Will I be able to use the same license on my laptop computer and on the iPhone or iPad?

A serial number issued for Rhyme 5 or higher allows you to get up to three activation codes to run the program on different devices. Please note that an activation code is linked to a specific computer or iOS device. Since we are unable to verify if a computer or iOS device has been stolen or is no longer in working condition we cannot accommodate requests to transfer licenses. Should you desire to activate Rhyme Genie on more than three devices please take advantage of our offer to purchase additional serial numbers for $7.95 each. With a newly purchased serial number you will be able to request three more activation codes. This licensing structure has not only allowed us to provide all of our users with major free updates since Rhyme Genie 1.0 but also makes the initial purchasing costs of our software a much lower investment than the software products offered by our competitors.
Last edited by mikehalloran on Mon Apr 14, 2014 9:26 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: MasterWriter 3 Released

Post by James Steele »

mikehalloran wrote:I will also let Barry and crew know what I think about making MW a web only app. Yech!
As someone who had been considering purchasing, I may also email them and let them know I've changed my mind and won't be doing so because of this. :(
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Re: MasterWriter 3 Released

Post by billf »

James Steele wrote:
mhschmieder wrote:Adobe is taking the same approach. I have participated in two of their surveys where I pointed out various reasons -- including the one in the original post -- why the cloud (as they now call this ancient technology and approach) is not a good solution for a number of contexts and users.

Each of these companies acts like their product is the center of everyone's universe, when in fact most of us (on this forum at least) have many dedicated apps that we need either in off-line use or irregularly and cannot afford to pay for monthly or annually. Multiply by hundreds of apps and plug-ins and you'd have to be a millionaire.

But of course the bigger issue is the trend towards having to be on-line to use an app. When I'm running a session, I try to be as off-line as possible, and when doing a remote session, it's a given.

Thanks for the heads-up; I will avoid this product update (I keep getting email reminders about it).
You're preaching to the choir here. I have Adobe Photoshop Elements which is fine for my needs. I wanted to find some sort of desktop publishing app and ended up thinking I'd see what Adobe had these days. Maybe a dumbed-down "Elements" sort app. I can't remember now the name of what it is. I was a big Pagemaker fan back in the day. Anyway, I go to Adobe's website and I see all this stuff about signing up for a monthly plan to use the software and I was confused and frankly, annoyed. I don't like that whole scenario. I want to buy my app... especially as you pointed out when I might use it infrequently and don't want to be on this sort of subscription model.

Finally it drove me to something cheaper but that does the trick for my modest needs: Swift Publisher 3. It's a little rough around the edges, but I've come up with workarounds, all because there's no visceral satisfaction about "renting" your app. I want to know I can install it on my computer and it damn well works. The cloud is a nice place for my calendar and address book contacts. I don't want to rely on it for apps. My 2 cents. :)
The rental model is horrible, and I do not want my work to be held hostage by that sort of thing. It's essentially what Waves tried with their original WUP rollout, but eventually they had to amend it because customers didn't like it. I still have and use Waves, but not as much as I once did, and that is largely because of the original WUP rollout. We have to speak with our wallets when companies try this sort of tactic.

As for Adobe, I have been a long time Adobe customer, but CS6 is the end of the line for me. Even if Adobe relents and reinstates the license model, they have lost my trust. I've been looking at alternatives and found a couple of others that can replace Photoshop. I'm still looking for Premiere and AE alternatives though.
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Re: MasterWriter 3 Released

Post by Prime Mover »

Yeah, CS6 may be our last version of Adobe's production software. CC is a mess, and doesn't seem to offer any advantages. The one saving grace is that CC isn't a web app (obviously), and I'm not sure you have to be online all the time to use it.

I recently did a calculation on my companies upgrades of Adobe software, and I did figure that the cloud route was actually cheaper, considering we tend to upgrade about every 3 years or so... it ended up working out in favor. So if, in the future, CC started offering something worthwhile, I could make a case for switching over, but i don't like it.
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Re: MasterWriter 3 Released

Post by billf »

Prime Mover wrote:Yeah, CS6 may be our last version of Adobe's production software. CC is a mess, and doesn't seem to offer any advantages. The one saving grace is that CC isn't a web app (obviously), and I'm not sure you have to be online all the time to use it.

I recently did a calculation on my companies upgrades of Adobe software, and I did figure that the cloud route was actually cheaper, considering we tend to upgrade about every 3 years or so... it ended up working out in favor. So if, in the future, CC started offering something worthwhile, I could make a case for switching over, but i don't like it.
Correct, CC is not a web app, it runs locally on your computer, but it is a rental. So if you decide to stop paying the rental, the software stops working, and you lose access to your files you created in CC applications. I know a lot of people who are moving away from Adobe as a result. It's a shame really.
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Re: MasterWriter 3 Released

Post by Thomas.B. »

mikehalloran wrote:
I can only recommend MasterWriter's main competitor Rhyme Genie. It comes with TuneSmith which you can install on as many computers as you wish and pretty much blows MasterWriter out of the water.
Really? How? MasterWriter has a number of features that don't exist in Rhyme Genie. - and vise versa. At $24.95, it's certainly a bargain and definitely a nice compliment to MW. I see nothing that "blows MasterWriter out of the water".
I have a feeling that once you put on the scuba gear and test the water by rhyming a few words in Rhyme Genie vs. MasterWriter you will agree.

You will be missing MasterWriter's MIDI drum loops and the integration with Songuard - both of which seem to have been removed from MasterWriter 3. I have to admit though that I haven’t used MasterWriter for quite a while. Which features are you thinking about?

As far as TuneSmith is concerned you can create lyrics sheets with guitar chord charts, track lyrics revisions, track contact info and song submissions, generate songwriter split sheets etc. All features that are non-existent or pretty limited in MasterWriter.
mikehalloran wrote:This is interesting:

Will I be able to use the same license on my laptop computer and on the iPhone or iPad?

A serial number issued for Rhyme 5 or higher allows you to get up to three activation codes to run the program on different devices.


Rhyme Genie would be better without the activation requirements but at least you get free updates. FYI an activation is only required for Rhyme Genie - not TuneSmith. You can basically install TuneSmith on as many computer as you like to access your song catalog. The only downside is that TuneSmith is not available for iOS.
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Re: MasterWriter 3 Released

Post by mikehalloran »

Even if Adobe relents and reinstates the license model, they have lost my trust.
Why is this a trust issue with Adobe? If you stop paying the subscription, does the software no longer work or do you just no longer receive updates? If the software no longer works, is your data hosed? I don't have CS 6 so I don't know.

What you call the "rental model" was the way all software was licensed before the personal computer.

In the case of MW 3, I agree. Because the software will no longer work and your data is gone should you stop paying, it is definitely a trust issue. You trust that the company will stay in business. If it doesn't, your data is gone and, if you relied on it, you are screwed.

As one of those who survived the first great wave of personal computing and spent more than a few dollars on vaporware (never again!), yes, I have trust issues.



Trust is so often used in these situations when it doesn't apply. "X Company didn't upgrade what I wanted the way I wanted, so I'm going to use something else..." Uhhh... ok, goodbye.

The Thunderbolt to PCIe issue is one of those places where trust doesn't apply, for example. MOTU made no promises and took no money on this. Were they to fold tomorrow, your 424 cards will still work on the computers and OS they were designed for. There is a lot of disappointment that it doesn't work and never will, true, but there are no trust issues there.
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Re: MasterWriter 3 Released

Post by mikehalloran »

I have a feeling that once you put on the scuba gear and test the water by rhyming a few words in Rhyme Genie vs. MasterWriter you will agree.
MasterWriter is an extension of the tools I have always used: paper and pen. I have been using it since 2003 when 1.0 first shipped. For my own reasons, it became far more useful in 2009, just before 2.0 shipped. Like any other tool including a word processor, its use for me is as a time saver. I don't use many of its features but I like the way the way that I can organize my thoughts.
You will be missing MasterWriter's MIDI drum loops and the integration with Songuard - both of which seem to have been removed from MasterWriter 3
Nope. I won't miss features that I don't use. Not a drum loops kind of guy. The drum loops feature is supposed to be included but wasn't ready for release - promised for a future update. Methinks that the cloud isn't ready for this.

Songuard isn't as good as the Library of Congress for protecting unpublished Works, IMO - at least I'm confident that the LoC will be around for a long time (back to the trust issue). Songuard's absolutely useless for protecting published Works, BTW. Anyway, I never used it. Interesting that neither the web site nor Facebook page have mentioned its absence. Since Songuard is included only the first year with earlier versions, I suspect that few coughed up the annual maintenance fee on it. Interestingly, SG is the one feature that they could use to help sell the Subscription idea so, of course, they took it out.
I have to admit though that I haven’t used MasterWriter for quite a while. Which features are you thinking about?
I like the way that the various dictionaries are organized. Pop Culture is quite useful, for example.
As far as TuneSmith is concerned you can create lyrics sheets with guitar chord charts, track lyrics revisions, track contact info and song submissions, generate songwriter split sheets etc. All features that are non-existent or pretty limited in MasterWriter.
I am looking forward to checking that out. I use other programs for various functions including Quickbooks and FileMaker but, if it can bring all of that 'in-house', it's well worth the $25 for Rhyme Genie even without 30 flavors of rhyming dictionaries or whatever. If I find it not very useful (say, I cannot export the data to QuickBooks or a FileMaker report), well RG still costs less than I can spend in an evening hanging with friends, right?

Back to MW3. It looks like the idea was to add a couple of features and put the whole thing in the cloud. The layout of the dictionaries is different but if there are new ones, it's not obvious and never mentioned anywhere. In fact, there's no comparison of feature sets - a bit of a red flag that I noticed.

I like upgraded software to be... hmmm, what's the word? ... oh yea: Better.

As I mentioned earlier, I hope that they still support the old license manager. This is one that must be managed over the internet and, when (not if) there's a problem, the LM must be reset on their server or your copy will not work.
Rhyme Genie would be better without the activation requirements
Oh really? Let's not go there, ok? It's cheap at $24.95, you get 3 activations and they sell you more at $7.95 for three. If the activation requirements protect their intellectual property, that gives them a fighting chance of staying alive.
Last edited by mikehalloran on Tue Apr 15, 2014 9:01 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: MasterWriter 3 Released

Post by artfarm1 »

There are some great deals on a used 'Thesaurus'in a lot of bookstores.

Don't even need to have the computer turned on!

Just sayin'....

Does one 'really need' MasterWriter? Sure, it's handy.

But I don't think everyone in Nashville owns it, for example.
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