Lack of supported Windows10 Drivers

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Discussion related to installation, configuration and use of MOTU hardware such as MIDI interfaces, audio interfaces, etc. with Windows
nsd3
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Lack of supported Windows10 Drivers

Post by nsd3 »

I've read previous posts regarding how to enable MOTU kit with Windows 10, but more to the point, when are MOTU going to release an up to date driver that is certified compatible with Windows 10?

Looking at the official driver download pages, the MOTU Audio Installer driver hasn't been updated since February 2014. I've had nothing but issues, some major, other merely irritating with the MOTU drivers and my Windows 8.1 rig since day one. I see I'm not alone either, yet MOTU seem hell bent on releasing an ever increasing array of equipment and absolutely no development work into their drivers. Do MOTU seriously think their drivers are so perfect they don't need any modification?

I've looked, and can't find any mention of MOTU support for Windows 10, and I'll not upgrade until such time as they officially support that platform.

It saddens me to say, that as much as I love working/using my Ultralite Mk3 Hybrid, when it finally gives up the ghost I'll not be buying anything from MOTU again. Good support, great equipment, but I have no faith in their desire to keep their driver software up to date and bug free. They simply don't seem to care.

If MOTU ever read this, they really need to consider posting up some information on their website regarding their driver development road map and Windows platform support.

Steve
steveo42
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Re: Lack of supported Windows10 Drivers

Post by steveo42 »

+1
MOTU under Windows seems to be the topic nobody wants to discuss. I have a new Ultralite AVB and while I have it working fine under Windows 10 it was not as easy at it needed to be. I too am concerned with the driver version because mine under Windows 10 Device Manager says:

MOTU AVB USB Audio v2.24.0.0
Date = 10/9/2014

And in the Event Details it says:

Device TUSBAUDIO_ENUM\VID_07FD&PID_0005&KS\0001f2fffe00317f requires further installation.

This troubles me.

Anyone from MOTU care to comment?
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mikehalloran
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Re: Lack of supported Windows10 Drivers

Post by mikehalloran »

Hi,

This is a user board and not affiliated with MOTU.

Occasionally, someone from MOTU may comment and we're grateful when they do but you cannot assume that MOTU even reads these posts.

Posting a Tech Link (support ticket at motu.com) is the best way to get a direct answer. If there is a specific problem you are trying to solve, they have phone support, too.
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steveo42
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Re: Lack of supported Windows10 Drivers

Post by steveo42 »

Thanks Mike. Points taken.

I'm going to wait a little and see if they re-introduce a new Windows 10 driver in the next few weeks. They had one a couple of weeks ago but from what I understand it was pulled due to people having problems. Maybe I'm imagining this as I didn't have my Ultralite AVB yet but I seem to remember something I read.
kevinwal
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Re: Lack of supported Windows10 Drivers

Post by kevinwal »

Seems like MOTU has released updated Windows 10 drivers for USB/Firewire devices. The version is v4.0.6.6814, released Oct. 28, 2015. I've installed them and have begun working with them with my aging 8pre. Okay so far.
Joachip
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Re: Lack of supported Windows10 Drivers

Post by Joachip »

If these rumors are correct, it's a race against time until Microsoft force-updates my perfectly working Windows 7 setup into a Windows 10 setup that may or may not function as well. For now I've taken certain steps to prevent this automatic upgrade from happening, but I might still lose the battle and end up without a working studio.

The text on the driver downloads page states that my PCI-424 + 2480 MkIII + 24 I/O system should work under Windows 10. But it's not written in a slightly vague way that makes me not entirely comfortable. My setup is "legacy" which might mean I'm in trouble. And I'm not a rich guy who can just replace $2700 worth of equipment at the blink of an eye.

Switching to Mac would mean that I couldn't use any of the many plugins I've written over the last 15 years.

So if anyone has any news on whether Windows 10 + "Legacy" Motu stuff is really working or not, I'm all ears.
Joachip
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2408mk3 Windows 10 Drivers

Post by Joachip »

A long time has passed, so this issue might have been resolved by now.

Does anyone use the 2408mk3 and/or 24I/O card under Windows 10? Could you please drop a few words about how your system is running, before I consider upgrading to Windows 10?

Is it stable?
Indiescore
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Re: 2408mk3 Windows 10 Drivers

Post by Indiescore »

Joachip wrote:A long time has passed, so this issue might have been resolved by now.

Does anyone use the 2408mk3 and/or 24I/O card under Windows 10? Could you please drop a few words about how your system is running, before I consider upgrading to Windows 10?

Is it stable?
I am in the same boat, Microsoft is really pushing 10 now, 24ai did not work with Windows 7 , 2408 works great but doesn't have the headroom and transparency , so. I might upgrade to win 10 and try both audio cards ........And return the 24ai if it doesn't work....just hoping to get a confirmation from someone first.
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jsr
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Re: Lack of supported Windows10 Drivers

Post by jsr »

kevinwal wrote:Seems like MOTU has released updated Windows 10 drivers for USB/Firewire devices. The version is v4.0.6.6814, released Oct. 28, 2015. I've installed them and have begun working with them with my aging 8pre. Okay so far.
Same version here working fine with Windows 10 x64 and an 828MkII FW. The only minor detail is that CueMix forgets the stereo pairs after each reboot, but all functions and, most importantly, audio seem to be fine.
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Re: Lack of supported Windows10 Drivers

Post by Joachip »

Thanks for your replies. It seems promising. I'll check it out soon.

I hope these drivers are signed in the way that Windows 10 requires after the "anniversary update" (I was just told by a Windows developer).
Joachip
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It works!

Post by Joachip »

So I bought a new harddrive so that I could test Windows 10, and still have an option to return to Windows 7 if things didn't work, but...

Good news to everyone with this question: I've just tested a freshly installed Windows 10, 64-bit with the PCI-424 and the 2408 mkIII and 24 I/O card. Everything appears to work perfectly and I've had no hiccups, crashes, deadlock or other bad things happens. Stability appears to be good, even though it's too early to say after just one night's intense testing.

I've mostly tested ASIO, as this is what the vast majority of my audio applications use.
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terrybritton
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Re: It works!

Post by terrybritton »

Joachip wrote:So I bought a new harddrive so that I could test Windows 10, and still have an option to return to Windows 7 if things didn't work, but...

Good news to everyone with this question: I've just tested a freshly installed Windows 10, 64-bit with the PCI-424 and the 2408 mkIII and 24 I/O card. Everything appears to work perfectly and I've had no hiccups, crashes, deadlock or other bad things happens. Stability appears to be good, even though it's too early to say after just one night's intense testing.

I've mostly tested ASIO, as this is what the vast majority of my audio applications use.
That has been my positive experience as well, with an Ultralite mk3 hybrid on my editing machine and an 828 mk3 hybrid on the main machine. I wish Windows would add aggregation to its native ASIO driver support like Macs have enjoyed for some time now, but I have found workarounds when more in-ports are needed in the meantime.

Once in a while, sample rate changes will not transition well, like when watching YouTube videos that are either 44100 or 48000 or when playing high sample rate music files via a media player, but I blame the WDM/ASIO system for that. Usually raising or lowering the sample rate in the Windows Audio control panel cures it, but not always, making a restart necessary. But that is when I am committing the sin of using my production machines as general-purpose computers, so it is really my own fault!

Terry
Computer: Sweetwater CS400v7 Intel Core i7-10700K CPU @ 3.80GHz | 64Gigs RAM | Windows 11 Pro x64 |
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Joachip
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Re: It (pretty much) works!

Post by Joachip »

Okay I might have been a bit too fast saying that everything works. - I'm seeing a new problem with Windows 10: Sometimes after booting up, the soundcard is in a state of confusion. It takes quite some massage of the "MOTU PCI Audio Console" thing and/or "scan for devices" in the Device Manager to bring it out of its zombie state before you have audio.

Rebooting is another way to fix it. I guess this driver is not quite perfect yet, but at least it appears to be usable once you learn the right occult healing moves. The error I get from the MOTU PCI program is:

An error has occurred in the AudioWire driver: An AudioWire driver client passed a null or bad object reference (10 Error 10 ..\Awdrvr.cpp 1582)

But you can make it go away by starting up the MOTU thing a few times, and once you manage to run it, start massaging the sample rate until the real devices appear. And once you've succeeded, the audio works.
terrybritton wrote:I wish Windows would add aggregation to its native ASIO driver support like Macs have enjoyed for some time now, but I have found workarounds when more in-ports are needed in the meantime.
I don't think we should expect too much from Microsoft in this aspect, as ASIO is made by Steinberg, not Microsoft. They want us to use WASAPI instead, but it's probably gonna be a few decades more before all the audio apps we use have been ported. The sample rate issue you've observed also happens in Windows 7 btw.
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terrybritton
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Re: Lack of supported Windows10 Drivers

Post by terrybritton »

Last night I was experimenting with approaches to changing the sample rate of the interface, and found that changing it in the MOTU Audio Console, then going into the Device Manager and first disabling the Motu Audio Driver and then re-enabling it saved me the trouble of switching off (or pulling the power plug on the Ultralite) and turning it on again.

If I leave Foobar2000 sending to the DS (DirectSound) interface in Windows, it switches without issue. ASIO requires jumping through the hoops. WASAPI/WDM reacts catastrophically to sample rate changes between 96000 and 44100, for instance.

Other than that stuff, Windows 10 is running very well.

Terry
Computer: Sweetwater CS400v7 Intel Core i7-10700K CPU @ 3.80GHz | 64Gigs RAM | Windows 11 Pro x64 |
MOTU 828 mk3 hybrid

DAWs & Live: MOTU Digital Performer 11.31 | Cantabile Performer 4
Keyboard Synths: Kawai K5000s, Korg Wavestation
Controllers: NI Komplete Kontrol S-88 Mk3 & S-49 Mk2; Maschine Mk3 & JAM;
Akai MPK249 & 225, Alesis QX49, Behringer BCF2000 & FCB1010
Rack Modules: Ensoniq ESQm, Yamaha TX81Z, Wavestation SR

Tutorials: https://youtube.com/@CreatorsMediaTools
atomheart
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Re: Lack of supported Windows10 Drivers

Post by atomheart »

I am so frustrated with this whole thing. Is there an actual verified protocol for running a Motu interface in Windows10? By that I mean looking at the voodoo you do, and knowing the voodoo I do just to get anything done it seems like a constantly moving target. Today only a total reboot of every machine will work. But only if the interface is off when the computer comes back on. Then reboot the interface and any machine I need to protect from the horrible loud pop that the interface makes upon power up. I've tried the repair of Motu hardware in the programs/features page. Although I've never seen the procedure you described of either (again) powering down the unit or disabling it in devices. Regardless it does sometimes work. And then sometimes Audio Console behaves and I can open it any time I want. Other times I have to shut down any program that may have anything to do with audio before it will open. Or not.
I recently had some luck flushing the DNS cache. I tried that because of an endless stream of errors of failure to resolve DNS in MotuZeroConf. That was causing total chaos of different sorts. Anything from digital noise to total system freeze. As it turned out Audio Console 'seemed' to be fixed as well. For all of about one day. I have uninstalled and re-installed Motu Hardware more times than I can count.
Some of us really do need Audio Console to change sample rates for different purposes. Did I mention that the interface regularly just disappears also? That wonderful "No audio device etc...." balloon window pop up. I used to love my 828x but this is ridiculous. I'm lucky if I can get two productive hours in before the voodoo dance starts again. Is it just the way it is? Is there are bonafide proper protocol that really is repeatable and trustworthy? Why is Audio Console so amazingly awful now?
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