MTPAV Parallel and Windows XP

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Discussion related to installation, configuration and use of MOTU hardware such as MIDI interfaces, audio interfaces, etc. with Windows
reeper
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Re: MTPAV Parallel and Windows XP

Post by reeper »

read the manual? lmao . anywy, this unit is obsolete - its 2008 now...
Last edited by reeper on Wed Nov 19, 2008 5:05 am, edited 1 time in total.
nerd info:Cubase 4.5.2. Xp x64. Asus p5q-e. 8gb ram
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Re: MTPAV Parallel and Windows XP

Post by James Steele »

$500? I didn't know they even sold "parallel" MTP/AVs any more? You paid $400 too much. Admittedly, I'm a Mac guy, so correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought parallel interfaces were pretty much dead or on the way out in the PC world. Windows users should be using a USB MIDI interface... at least for $500!!!

Something is wrong with this scenario.
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Re: MTPAV Parallel and Windows XP

Post by James Steele »

Uhhh... okay... I won't criticize how much you choose to pay for your gear. I don't know why it doesn't work, but I'm sure blaming MOTU first is always the best way to deal with it. Perhaps someone else can help you with a real solution or you can try calling MOTU early in the morning. Your post edited for kisses.
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Re: MTPAV Parallel and Windows XP

Post by James Steele »

shanabit wrote:Ill give them a buzz. thanks James
\

You've probably heard this already, but it can be tough to get through to them. They don't have any on-hold system, so you have to re-dial over and over. It's best to get up and start dialing right at 9am EST as that's when it's least busy from what I've heard. Good luck.
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Re: MTPAV Parallel and Windows XP

Post by topquark »

So ...were all supposed to just run out and buy the newest version of equipment when our old stuff is/was working just fine?...In my situation I had an MTP AV Parallel from many years ago and over time I kept buying up old rack mounts until I outgrew the one i have ...so just to make things easier I got onto Ebay and got another Identicle units for a grand total of 40 bucks just to add more ports ...I see no reason to run out and spend 500 bucks just to add more ports to an already working system ....I did however get the newest drivers off the MOTU site and tried to install them and now for the life of me I cant get my units to work right ...they must have changed something...and im sure it behooves them anyway to give less and less support to polder equipment because they are simply not making any money on old equipment ...Its kinda the same thing as buying used CDs from Pawn Shops or off Ebay, the artists are not getting paid on one hand..but on the other hand, those CDs were bought already one time so the artist already got paid for it..its a circular argument like a dog chasing its tail or pro choice vs pro life ..there will never be an end to the argument .... :shake:
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Re: MTPAV Parallel and Windows XP

Post by topquark »

Something got mis interpreted here ..I didnt spend no 500 bucks on a parallel unit..hell no!...I found a second one on Ebay for 75 bucks,,then with shipping it ended up being 100...still a lot of money ....I would switch over to mac systems but it would just flat out be way too much money....with all the software I have bought over the years it would cost a fortune to replace it all if i started using mac...If mac would give me all new free replacement software, you bet id be all over it ...I cant even upgrade to 64 bit either unless they come up with some sort of converter that will allow me to run 32 bit audio software, theres just no way im gonna shell out that kind of money just for an upgrade..Ill deal with good old fashioned 44.1 recording...now if someone comes along and wants to employ me or likes my music and wants to pay me for my hobby ..THEN Ill run out and buy all the upgrades ...anyway..I just went and bought two USB MOTU MIDI express 128's....all the drivers went in fine, the machine recornized them fine ..everything is good except....non of my sequencer programs will see them ....I know its old..but im using Sonar 4 Producer ...according to the MOTU manual the little configuration program will not work with the express 128 ..the only way wo configure it is to use your sequencing software and it aint seeing it ...so now im stuck ..im gonna have to send these suckers back ..
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Re: MTPAV Parallel and Windows XP

Post by Musicdoctor »

Since many years under Windows 98, Windows XP, Windows Vista and now under Windows7 64bit - I´m using a pair of MTP-AV´s, yes these LPT/parallel port ones (with LCD + 4 endless dials), today they´re working like at their first day.

The funniest thing is: if you´ve got a bit into MIDI, make a feedback loop on all 16 channels, record this back into your sequencer and "take measure" of the latencies you´ve got, calculate the average of the values, now do the same thing on all 32 channels, additionally you can take note of the max. and min. values and compare them later.

Then if you´ve got the possibility, do the same with two or just one of the newest USB2.0 MTP-AV´s on 16channels (to begin with). Both were feeded by MIDI data, connected on a good music workstation, 12 core, 32GB RAM, 64GB PCIxpress SSD Card(drive), SSD + SAS raids and some more gimmicks, all the same like with the MTP parallel versions as before tested.

It took some time, but I´ve done the comparisons and: I laughed my xyz off, when those USB2.0 MTP came with up to five times more average latency into the sequencer tracks than the old parallel MTP´s, recording them on all 32ch got me really :shock: the average latency measured was 9 times the average latency I´ve got with the old LPT port MTP´s - all min. latencies measured with the MPT USB2.0 were 3 times higher than the MTP parallel port versions, the max latencies even more.

After my testings I returned both MTP-AV USB2.0 units right back to the store. Obsolete? :rofl: ... not for now ...
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Re: MTPAV Parallel and Windows XP

Post by James Steele »

It's unfortunate that perhaps MIDI Time Stamping is not supported on Windows. Maybe it must be built into the DAW? Run that test using USB MTP/AVs on Mac OSX and Digital Performer and you'd probably get much better results. I don't think it's the fault of the USB hardware per se, but either the Windows drivers or the DAW software isn't taking advantage of the MIDI Time Stamping capabilities of the units that exist when using the same hardware on Mac OSX. If so, that's unfortunate and don't know how MOTU could remedy this. If the DAW software needs to support MTS, then Windows DAW developers would need to build in proper support, provided they can get the proper SDK from MOTU.
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Musicdoctor
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Re: MTPAV Parallel and Windows XP

Post by Musicdoctor »

Hello James Steele,
yes you are totally right here, the DAW has to support MIDI-timestamping.
My testings were done without timestamping enabled, just to see the MIDI "processing/transmission power" over USB.
Personally I don´t use any DAW to compose/record MIDI data, I only use a DAW for audio recording/replay. The few soft-synths I use are in a "VST rack" (outside of DAW) so they are triggered via MIDI in realtime by one or more of my hardwaresequencer´s, I have 2x QY700, a Polymorph, a Spectralis, the "old" Sequentix P3 (I'll replace it as soon as when it´s my turn on the pre-order list for the new Cirklon) - so for sequencing I´ve got a lot of gear to work with, more intuitive and creative for me.
How do I get all in sync? Well, while working with the sequencers I choose one for main-midiclock, when a track is ready by means of MIDI-recordings to record the audio tracks from the hardware synths, etc., I let anything (sequencers, synths, outboard-efx) run, with MIDI-ox I measure timing of incoming MIDI data, if I see anything going out of sync, then usually it´s more or less static lag/latency, this I resolve giving a certain MIDI channel a delay-time, at the end my results in means of sync are very tight. :D
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Re: MTPAV Parallel and Windows XP

Post by jazzr »

Hey Musicdoctor,
I am just getting back into home recording after about 10 years of inactivity. I have a MTP AV Parallel version and I want to incorporate it into my current setup. I have 3 or 4 sound modules that I want to control via MIDI. I have a Focusrite Saffire 6 USB recording interface and a Dell Latitude E6400. Will I be able to get everything working together (record vocal tracks with the Saffire while playing back "recorded" MIDI data)? After reading your other post regarding connections I gather that I will need a capable ExpressCard to LPT Parallel adaptor card (http://www.provantage.com/startech-ec1p ... TR912J.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;). Please correct me if I'm wrong, but won't I also need the correct drivers to make it all work? I'm running XP, now, but might go to Windows 7 soon. Where can I get these drivers?
Thanks in advance!
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Re: MTPAV Parallel and Windows XP

Post by Prado Escondido »

I came here for a queston of my own ... but saw yours.

I got a used MTAVP Parallel as a $35.00 throw in at music equip 'garage sale.' Found the right cable at Frys, registered at MOTU and bought a manual for the USB model, downloaded the drivers and the Clockworks software and it has worked flawlessly.

As a matter of fact, there is a lot of chatter on the Sonar forums that the parallel is the only one that really works on Windows and the USB due to hardware sync issues is time sloppy.

I can't see any reason why you couldn't use it successfully if you have some type of parellel port to your computer.

Prado
Escondido, CA
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Re: MTPAV Parallel and Windows XP

Post by jazzr »

Prado,
Thanks for your input. How did you connect the MTP AV to your computer (what adaptor did you use)? Will connecting a USB recording interface (like my Saffire 6 USB) along with the MTP AV work? This is my first step into recording digitally into the computer and I want to be sure older legacy stuff will work together with new ones.
Thanks!
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Re: MTPAV Parallel and Windows XP

Post by Musicdoctor »

MTP-AV PARALLEL PORT INSTALLATION (for WIN VISTA and WIN 7 - 32bit only):

1) Computer turned off, connect/attach your MTP-AV to a parallel port and turn the power of your MTP-AV on.
IMPORTANT: To ensure future proper working, ALWAYS TURN YOUR MTP-AV on BEFORE STARTING your computer/booting/loading Windows.

A) In BIOS set Parallel Port / LPT to NORMAL MODE, save BIOS-settings and reboot/boot into Windows, if this is not setup properly you´ll fail to install the MTP-AV drivers properly.

B) Open the system control panel (Start\Settings\Control Panel)

C) Select the Hardware tab and click Device Manager

D) Open the Ports (COM & LPT) tree

E) Right click the #Printer Port (LPTX)# to which you´ve attached your MIDI interface and select #Properties#

F) Select the #Port Settings# tab

G) Select the #Use any interrupt assigned to the port# option for #Filter Resource Method#

H) Click #OK# and close the device Manager window, returning to the System Properties control panel

I) Click the #Hardware Wizard# button.

J) Select #Add/Troubleshoot a device# and click next

K) Select #Add a new device# and click next

L) Select #No, I want to select the hardware from a list# option and click next

M) Choose #Sound video and game controllers# and click next

N) Click #Have Disk#

O) Browse to the location of the installer, the file #MotuPar.inf# should be located in this directory.

P) Select the #MOTU Parallel MIDI# model and click next

Q) The wizard will now detect a MIDI driver, click ok/next for all options

R) Click next and ok for all remaining dialogs, and your interface is now installed

S) Restart/reboot your computer, IMPORTANT: ENSURE YOUR MTP-AV is turned on

T) Install Clockworks, if not already installed, start it, wait and see your MTP-AV connected.

NOTES: Under Windows 7 32bit, may appear messages like "THIS DRIVER IS NOT SIGNED" or anything related/similar, ignore these messages and press "continue/install anyway" - if your computer is properly configured, there will be no problems showing up.

If your MTP-AV should appear as "Flyer" you have missed any of the aforementioned steps. In this case you´ll have to uninstall the driver, search Win-registry manually for any remains of the driver/Motu files, delete them, reboot, install driver again. :x :deadhorse:

Download the drivers+Clockworks here: http://downloads.motu.com/MTPWin/SETUPMIDI_2.51.zip" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Have a look at my other post, about specifying how any Parallel card has to be...http://www.motunation.com/forum/viewtop ... 57#p368191" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
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Re: MTPAV Parallel and Windows XP

Post by jazzr »

Thanks very much, Musicdoctor! One more question: Will this setup work on XP 32bit? And how about Windows 7 64-bit?
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Re: MTPAV Parallel and Windows XP

Post by Musicdoctor »

The drivers provided by the download link will work from Windows XP to Windows 7 - 32 bit versions.

On an older backup-harddrive I´ve had a MTP-AV driver for Win XP up to 7 - beeing 64bit, it was published for Vista 64bit, I never tried it under any 64bit OS. These driver would most probably work on the latest Windows XP 64bit, this version beeing Windows XP Professional x64 Edition with SP2.
In november last year I tried already to extract this 64bit driver, in request from other users, but wasn´t able to do so, the drive couldn´t be restored.
I looked already on all webfolders, from Motu, over Klemm, but at the publicly available download-locations I wasn´t able to spot this 64bit driver anymore. When I downloaded them, it was at http://klemm-music.de/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; on their FTP server about october/november of 2009.

EDIT: website URL
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