FIX: Running Motu FW devices in XP SP2, SP3

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Mark S
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Joined: Tue Apr 26, 2005 10:01 pm
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Re: FIX: Running Motu FW devices in XP SP2, SP3

Post by Mark S »

I've spent the bulk of two days installing and uninstalling the different driver versions and would like to offer a report:

MSI Neo II platinum with Dual operton proc ,2 gig ram MOTU 896hd, 8pre
Sonar 6PE Sonar 7PE

Rolled back 1394 drivers to SP1 version Units synced immediately

Tried the following driver version:
3.6.7.0
3.6.7.4
3.6.8.1359
2.6.8.1360

All versions would load, but none would allow sonar to open when both units powered on in ASIO mode. Units seemed to lose sync when Sonar called on the driver.

All versions would allow Sonar to open and see all 16 input channels in WDM mode. So for it seems I'll be using that mode on this particular system. When I get my laptop running I'll report back.

BTW, settled on driver version 3.6.7.4 since it was the last one pre MkIII, and the latest ones double the latency.

Here's a thread I started on the Cakewalk forum (gear section) about all this:

http://forum.cakewalk.com/tm.asp?m=1594083

One guy has been successfully running 4 units using the older drivers and sp1 1394 drivers
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TheRealRoach
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Re: FIX: Running Motu FW devices in XP SP2, SP3

Post by TheRealRoach »

Mark S wrote: All versions would load, but none would allow sonar to open when both units powered on in ASIO mode. Units seemed to lose sync when Sonar called on the driver.
Have you done the second step: registry hacking with Sidspeed adjustments?
Mike Rocha
http://www.mikerocha.ca
Custom ADK, Quad 3.0ghz, 4gig ram, Win7 64-bit, Motu 3.6.7.3 x64 drivers
Macbook Pro 13" touchbar, High Sierra, 73220 drivers
Motu 896 x 4
Mark S
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Re: FIX: Running Motu FW devices in XP SP2, SP3

Post by Mark S »

Yes (that was my first thought). My routine was to check all the 1394 drivers and the registry at each attempt to make sure nothing was changed. I was fairly methodical since I wanted to narrow in on a working solution. The onboard firewire is 1384a so I have sidspeed set for 400 (2), the card max. And as soon as I load the sp1 drivers things sync hard and fast. That part really works.

Honestly, it's not a total surprise since this system always has seems to like WDM better, and I'm able to operate at 2.7ms latency, so that's not so bad now is it. And I get all my channels to boot.
VigilantSound
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Re: FIX: Running Motu FW devices in XP SP2, SP3

Post by VigilantSound »

1,Im curious, What buffer settings are you guys using?(Only if you have pops and squeals please)

2, I believe there is a MS hot fix that addresses this issue all together, you can read more on RME's site(Has anybody else tried this?) I did it and my system is stable but not perfect.(and no better than before) I run 32 buffers though! That is why i asked, i only get pops and squeals once i record about 16 tracks and start to add plugins.
Here are the links for what i did.
RME tech note
http://www.rme-audio.de/en_support_tech ... irewire_xp

MS Artical
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/885222/en-us

So, is what I am experiencing the classic motu squeals because of the FW driver or just because its to much for my machine at 32 samples and i should just raise my buffer to 128 for mixing and let it go? I would like to know before I dive in fixin something that is hardly broken.

Specs
asus P5BV-C
Intel Core 2 Quad Q9300 2.5 ghz
4 gig ram
GeForce 8600 gt
XP sp2
828mk3
FW with TI Chipset
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TheRealRoach
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Re: FIX: Running Motu FW devices in XP SP2, SP3

Post by TheRealRoach »

This "Fix" was based on the RME fix that you link, as well as information in the MS link. That hotfix was the first thing I attempted but it didn't work out, nor did it work out for a lot of people. But user experiences have been varied as with all things. Trust me I would have preferred for a simple hotfix to do the trick.

I'm running almost the same system as you and I keep it at 64 sample buffer size. I've run mixes of 100+ channels, half of which had Waves SSL, plus master bus fx, as well as 3 different external hardware effects returns, plus recording into it. I was partly trying to break the system but it held together.

What DAW are you running? There are lots of X-scaling issues with using a quad in the Cubase world, and also in other DAWs from what I hear. Low latency cubase systems are more stable if you only use two of the cores. Basically a lot of DAW's get exponentially more unstable/jittery with their CPU usage as you keep lowering the buffer size... It should obviously be a linear relationship.
Mike Rocha
http://www.mikerocha.ca
Custom ADK, Quad 3.0ghz, 4gig ram, Win7 64-bit, Motu 3.6.7.3 x64 drivers
Macbook Pro 13" touchbar, High Sierra, 73220 drivers
Motu 896 x 4
VigilantSound
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Re: FIX: Running Motu FW devices in XP SP2, SP3

Post by VigilantSound »

What DAW are you running? There are lots of X-scaling issues with using a quad in the Cubase world, and also in other DAWs from what I hear. Low latency cubase systems are more stable if you only use two of the cores. Basically a lot of DAW's get exponentially more unstable/jittery with their CPU usage as you keep lowering the buffer size... It should obviously be a linear relationship.
I'm Running SONAR 8.2, And i had herd that multi core systems can cause problems. SONAR has an option to only use one core and this made things worse for me, although others have claimed it works.

I want to try this rollback but Im a little un-confident, you see im not really a "computer guy" All i know now came out of necessity for recording purposes.
When i swap drivers I would like to try the device manager method mentioned earlier in the post, you say your system is similar and it did not work for you?

Also I do not really know how to restore from a back up? I have Acronis and I have used it successfully , but only to restore to factory settings. I have a back up made and i think i understand how to restore just have not done it and im a little nervous about messing around in the registry, But i really want better performance through my MOTU.

Also in step 1.3 locate sp2.cab? Where is this
OK I think i found sp2. cab i moved to a flash drive do i delete the one still in WINDOWS/drivercache?

OK I cannot get these driver file to stay gone, i deleted all as directed yes shift+Delete?

Ok, I got the filles delted for good, i had to do a hard shutdown right after i deleted them, i now sounds wrong but it worked the found new hardware poped up and i directed it to the sp1 drivers, so far all is good,
VigilantSound
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Re: FIX: Running Motu FW devices in XP SP2, SP3

Post by VigilantSound »

OK, So every thing is the same still im still getting the squeals, i would not say worse just the same. it was worth a shot though!

One more thing though. Am I supposed to change/Add the SidSpeed entry for just the fire wire or for the motu entries to?
Its a little unclear in the instructions.

Im still gonna try a few different driver versions as well, and if that does not work, i guess im going to VISTA! (thats whats on my other machine and surprisingly it works better with the motu, no squeals at all)
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TheRealRoach
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Re: FIX: Running Motu FW devices in XP SP2, SP3

Post by TheRealRoach »

VigilantSound wrote:OK, So every thing is the same still im still getting the squeals, i would not say worse just the same. it was worth a shot though!

One more thing though. Am I supposed to change/Add the SidSpeed entry for just the fire wire or for the motu entries to?
Its a little unclear in the instructions.
The sidspeed entry is for the FW bus, or in other words, it is for the firewire card and port, not the motu itself. By changing this you are telling the system to allow full speed for anything that connects to it, whether it's a MOTU 896, or a firewire hard drive.

This fix hasn't been entirely successful for everyone, but it has helped a good number of users. I would suggest re-reading it and going through all of the checks to ensure things were performed correctly. Also keep in mind that I'm still using 3.6.7.0. 3.6.7.4 also seems to be working well for some users.
Mike Rocha
http://www.mikerocha.ca
Custom ADK, Quad 3.0ghz, 4gig ram, Win7 64-bit, Motu 3.6.7.3 x64 drivers
Macbook Pro 13" touchbar, High Sierra, 73220 drivers
Motu 896 x 4
VigilantSound
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Re: FIX: Running Motu FW devices in XP SP2, SP3

Post by VigilantSound »

Im using a mk3 and the older drivers seem to have more latency.
djtweed
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Re: FIX: Running Motu FW devices in XP SP2, SP3

Post by djtweed »

+1 for the 3.6.7.0 drivers! After 4 days of squeaks and pops, I'm working like a champ.

896HD / WinXP SP3 / Buffer: 256 / SP1 FireWire Drivers

Thanks to MOTUNATION for these awesome boards!!!!
Peace,
George
Mark S
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Re: FIX: Running Motu FW devices in XP SP2, SP3

Post by Mark S »

djtweed wrote:+1 for the 3.6.7.0 drivers! After 4 days of squeaks and pops, I'm working like a champ.

896HD / WinXP SP3 / Buffer: 256 / SP1 FireWire Drivers

Thanks to MOTUNATION for these awesome boards!!!!
Peace,
George
tried to respond to your pm but can't seem to figure out where the send button is. Still looks like you got it! Glad to hear it's working well
djtweed
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Re: FIX: Running Motu FW devices in XP SP2, SP3

Post by djtweed »

Mark S wrote:
djtweed wrote:+1 for the 3.6.7.0 drivers! After 4 days of squeaks and pops, I'm working like a champ.

896HD / WinXP SP3 / Buffer: 256 / SP1 FireWire Drivers

Thanks to MOTUNATION for these awesome boards!!!!
Peace,
George
tried to respond to your pm but can't seem to figure out where the send button is. Still looks like you got it! Glad to hear it's working well
The 3.6.7.0 drivers are working great. I just have one question... Does the footswitch work on a 896HD with these drivers? Mine is not working, and I'm too afraid to change the working drivers.

It could be my unit, so I thought I would ask the group. Is anyone using the footswitch on 3.6.7.0?
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TheRealRoach
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Re: FIX: Running Motu FW devices in XP SP2, SP3

Post by TheRealRoach »

Footswitch should work fine. Mine does on 3.6.7.0. Make sure that you configure it and assign what command the footswitch controls.
Mike Rocha
http://www.mikerocha.ca
Custom ADK, Quad 3.0ghz, 4gig ram, Win7 64-bit, Motu 3.6.7.3 x64 drivers
Macbook Pro 13" touchbar, High Sierra, 73220 drivers
Motu 896 x 4
casedawg
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Re: FIX: Running Motu FW devices in XP SP2, SP3

Post by casedawg »

Can the 3.6.7.0 drivers be used with Mk3 units?
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TheRealRoach
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Re: FIX: Running Motu FW devices in XP SP2, SP3

Post by TheRealRoach »

I think others have mentioned using 3.6.7.0 with the mk3s.
Mike Rocha
http://www.mikerocha.ca
Custom ADK, Quad 3.0ghz, 4gig ram, Win7 64-bit, Motu 3.6.7.3 x64 drivers
Macbook Pro 13" touchbar, High Sierra, 73220 drivers
Motu 896 x 4
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