DP9: Editing w/ external waveform editor destroys audio

[stubbsonic]

I suppose it is possible that the file is not "corrupted". If you can open the file in the external editor, if you can quit and relaunch and it plays, it might be that the file is ok. But weirdly, some change is happening that is causing DP misread the resulting saved file.

I did a quick test on my system with DP 8.07, using 16 bit broadcast wave and DSP Quattro. It worked without issue.

Let us know what MOTU advices. They may be able to analyze the file change from the external editor and track down what it does to make it unplayable.

You might want to do your test, but while you are in the external editor, see if you can save to a different location so MOTU can have a look at that file for signs of a problem.

[m2pi]

I suppose it is possible that the file is not "corrupted". If you can open the file in the external editor, if you can quit and relaunch and it plays, it might be that the file is ok. But weirdly, some change is happening that is causing DP misread the resulting saved file.

I did a quick test on my system with DP 8.07, using 16 bit broadcast wave and DSP Quattro. It worked without issue.

Let us know what MOTU advices. They may be able to analyze the file change from the external editor and track down what it does to make it unplayable.

You might want to do your test, but while you are in the external editor, see if you can save to a different location so MOTU can have a look at that file for signs of a problem.

We may have a copy of Quattro installed somewhere here ... Let me give it a try.

It's a shareware, isn't it? I may just download & register that, just to find out what's going on.

Meanwhile, have you tried a 24-bit / 48000-hz audio settings?

[Phil O]

Meanwhile, have you tried a 24-bit / 48000-hz audio settings?

That's an interesting point. A few years back I was trying to export audio from Finale. Finale (for some unknown reason was exporting 44.1K audio at 44.099999K or something like that. (I can't remember if I discovered that in the finder with "Get Info" of if it showed up in the "Import Audio" window in DP). It played fine in QT but DP choked on it. Had to use 48K.

Phil

[m2pi]

**snipped**
I did a quick test on my system with DP 8.07, using 16 bit broadcast wave and DSP Quattro. It worked without issue.

Here's my test result. Thank you for your constructive input(s), by the way.

1) On DP9, the recording resolution is now set to 16-bit Broadcast WAVE instead.
2) Audio is recorded, and immediately edited w/ DSP-Quattro.
3) The edited audio is closed ... now back to DP9.
4) DP9 plays back the externally edited file just fine.
5) Now I assigned the external editor to Wavelab instead.
6) Again, audio is recorded on DP9, and immediately edited w/ Wavelab.
7) Back in DP9. It plays back fine.
Then I deleted all recorded files in the soundbite list, and set up DP9 to record 24-bit Broadcast WAVE.
9) DSP-Quattro is specified as the external waveform editor.
10) Then on DP9, audio is recorded, and immediately edited w/ DSP-Quattro.
11) Back to DP9. ... there it is. The audio plays back with FULL OF NOISE.

So at this point, we can safely conclude that there's a bug in DP's 24-bit audio file interpreter.

This should be considered a shame for MOTU for the following reasons:
a) The same bug might've been reported back in the DP7 era (at least I reported), but they wouldn't take it seriously
b) No one in the DP user community raised flag > the DP userbase is still at 16-bit, while everyone else is fully compatible w/ 24-bit recording/editing

Y'all are more than welcome to test this feature by yourself. Set your DP to record 24-bit, and edit a recorded audio with an external waveform editor. Let me know how that turns out.

[MIDI Life Crisis]

I don't know that i would classify it as a bug as much as an incompatibility. The other editors are behaving, so DP is clearly doing what it is supposed to be doing and the other editors are providing the proper file formats.

It would seem that the two developers need to talk to each other about it, but a bug? The jury is still out on that one.

[HCMarkus]

Report, adding data point:
I can (and more than occasionally do) drag and drop 24 bit 44.1k and 48k BWAV files into iZotope RX5, then save the altered files and drag back into DP9, and "move to original timestamp" without issue.

[stubbsonic]

Since you saw the same issue in BOTH DSP Quattro AND in WaveLab, then this does appear to be a BUG or at least an incompatibility that needs to be addressed in one way or another by MOTU. Or perhaps we can find a workaround.

I tested this again on my system, this time using 24 bit broadcast wave and it worked perfectly. I was unable to replicate the problem. When I opened a stereo file in DSP Quattro to edit, it went out as two mono files (non-interleaved) which got me to wondering if this might be an interleaving problem. So I went back and did another test, with the interleave box checked, and did an edit but it came back fine.

So on my system, Broadcast Waves, 24-bit 44.1K interleaved or non-interleaved both went out to DSP Quattro and back without an issue. I don't have Wavelab, so I can't test that one for you.

[Gravity Jim]

So at this point, we can safely conclude that there's a bug in DP's 24-bit audio file interpreter.

No, you can't.

All you can conclude is that there is something wrong between DP and your editor on your system. You have no other information.

What really bothers me most about folks hurrying into this forum and screaming, "BUG!" before they've talked to MOTU, talked to the third party, or done any real troubleshooting its that users rarely come back and says, "Hey remember that problem I had? It was bad RAM/user error/a bug in the other thing/I didn't RTFM." So the Bug Alarm stands on this page for endless time.

And if you think we're all running our systems in 16-bit, you're wrong. We're not.

You need to dig deeper. Or, dig at all.

[stubbsonic]

Jim, you assume he didn't troubleshoot or RTFM. You also assume (incorrectly) that this is an issue with one version of DP or with one editor.

The OP has reported that he has seen this issue with WaveLab & DSP Quattro using DP9 and with DP7 using Bias Peak.

Yes, there maybe another cause, and it might not be a bug, but clearly some effort and anguish has been spent on this. And the steps to reproduce were clearly documented.

Don't shoot the messenger.

I think it is a fair point that if this is resolved, the thread subject and opening post should be revised. But not before then.

[supersonic]

I use RX 5 and this same behaviour can sometimes be observed, although it is rare and I am not able to reproduce it in many other projects. However once a file gets corrupt (I always make a copy of the file I am editing just in case) I can go back to the original and the same thing will happen to this one as well. But it is rather rare.

[m2pi]

Hello,

The MOTU Tech support has just replied. They were able to recreate the situation.

This issue is now escalated to the engineering.

Stay tuned for more news.

Goodbye for now.

[cuttime]

The MOTU Tech support has just replied. They were able to recreate the situation.
.

Thanks for this follow up. Much appreciated.

[MIDI Life Crisis]

That's great bad news. Wait, what?

[m2pi]

PS: As I read through some replies, I am astonished to find out how rude, condescending, and insincere some members are while others are trying to solve issues.

I am merely presenting facts, as well as specific steps to recreate the issue.

Just follow the steps (that is, IF you have a 24-bit capable & working external waveform editor with you), and the bug will appear right in front of you.

[MIDI Life Crisis]

I am astonished to find out how rude, condescending, and insincere some members are while others are trying to solve issues.

You can read that into a post just from text. Amazing!