Bizarre pitch change error!?!

[RodneySauer]

I recorded a bunch of takes last Friday, and am just now getting around to mixing them.

As I was combining the piecemeal recordings of a particular piece, I found to my great surprise that one of the takes had been transposed UP a little over a major second from where it was played! What's more, everything I had recorded from that point on that day was similarly distorted. It plays fast, my voice sounds like Mickey Mouse on the count-ins, and it's clear that somehow DP is playing these particular soundbites faster than they should go. We regularly listen to previous takes while recording, so I can't imagine that these pieces were corrupted at the time they were recorded. We would have noticed.

I'm now using Time Machine to retreive a copy of that day's backup. But what can have happened to make sound bites play back at the wrong pitch and speed?

Thanks for any tips...

DP 8.07, OS 10.10.1.

[RodneySauer]

Sadly, the backup behaves no differently.

[Shooshie]

This sounds like the kind of error that happens when a file recorded at 48 KHz is played in a project at 44.1 KHz without converting it, though that's not a problem that usually happens in DP. Maybe there is another explanation, and maybe someone else will be able to enlighten us. If not, then maybe there is something that caused that to happen. Sorry to be vague, but I'm just tossing out guesses.

[bayswater]

That's what it sounds like to me too. I recently changed my default from 44.1 to 48, and this happens a lot to me when I bring in material from an older project.

There are many references to sample rate conversion in the manual starting around p44 if you want to mix at a different sample rate than used while recording.

[MIDI Life Crisis]

Either a black hole recently developed between the Earth and the Moon or my friends are correct about the sample rate affecting pitch.

[RodneySauer]

This seems logical. I record for DVD scores, so I've had DP set at 48k for years. I double checked the tool bar and the MOTO Audio Setup app and everything still says 48 kHz. I turned on the "Sample Rate" column in the sound bites window, and it says that all soundbites are 48000.

So, might the following be what happened?

Partway through my recording session, the software hiccuped and converted -- partially -- to 44.1. I wouldn't have noticed because the playbacks would have been at 44.1 too. I save and quit, and when I start DP this morning, it resets to 48 kHz. The audio files were actually recorded 44.1, but DP thinks they're 48 kHz, so they play faster and at a higher pitch.

If that is what happened, is there a way to salvage these audio files by (a) convincing DP that they are 44.1, and (b) having DP convert them to 48? It represents about three hours of work by a five-piece ensemble that has trouble scheduling...

[Shooshie]

If the afflicted soundbites won't convert to 48K, you might first convert them to 88K, then back to 48K. I'd go UP in resolution so that no information is lost. Then when you convert back to 48, the info should be as high-resolution as it was when it started. You might also tell it to make copies of the conversions, rather than replacing the originals. That's another way to insure that no data is lost.

One way or another, you've got to get DP to convert those files (or use an external app) to 48K, and to be sure that you are actually playing back at 48K.

Whatever could have caused the hiccup you mentioned?

Shooshie

[RodneySauer]

I wish to heck I knew why it did this, but thanks to the tips given by you all, I seem to have solved it.

Unfortunately, MOTU only lets you convert from other sample rates to the current project rate, so to convince it that these files should be considered to be 44.1 kHz I had to start by converting the whole project to 44.1 kHz.

Then I selected all of the audio soundbites that were affected by this (sorting by the "time created" made this easy), and selected "convert audio file." I checked "Sample Rate," entered 44100, and checked the box labelled "Only change the file's recognized sample rate but do not process the file's audio."

Now I convert the project from 44.1 kHz back to 48 kHz. MOTU, now knowing that these soundbites are 44.1 kHz converts them to 48 kHz. The other files seem to be unaffected.

I sincerely hope that this was a one-time fluke, because MAN is it irritating!

[RodneySauer]

Well, the old pitch-change bug described above is back: everything I just recorded today is pitched up. So, this bug was not fixed in DP 9.0. Again, I don't think it's particularly reproducible, it just pops up and screws me up every few months. I did not change the sample rate, the sample rate is still set at 48 kHz, but apparently today for much of our session DP was recording (and playing back) at 44.1 kHz. Now that I've re-opened the session to mix it, everything is playing back at the wrong rate.

Let's hope the hoop-jumping I worked out last time works again this time...

[RodneySauer]

Well, it kind of worked. But all of the edge fades I did before noticing the pitch change were deleted, every soundbite is butted up against its neighbors with no crossfades. This may be a separate bug in DP 9: I've noticed that if I import a clipping file, all of the edge edits get removed; which I don't think was the case in DP8. I've learned the keyboard short cut to "put an edge edit at every patch," but unfortunately that makes all the edge edits the same, which may not be what I originally did before creating the clipping file.

[stubbsonic]

There might be some setting with your audio hardware that is causing it to slave to a slower clock. Double-check and make sure the rate of your hardware is also set to 48K. Also, make sure that it is not slaving to any incoming time-code source.

You would think that it would cause some audio to play back more slowly (if it was synching to 44.1K).

That's a weird one. At least you have a work-around (albeit an irritating one).

[RodneySauer]

I HAVE FOUND THE CULPRIT!!!!

It's Finale.

I had opened Finale (version 2014c.v4736) to print out a part for one of the instrumentalists just before the error hit, and it's plausible that this was the trigger each time this has happened. I just attempted to recreate the error, and I was able to, quite reproducibly.

Start Digital Performer with a project with a sample rate of 48000 (or probably any sample rate other than 44.1 kHz).

The popup menu in the menu bar says 48 kHz. Also, the sample rate menu in the MOTU Audio Setup application says 48000, and the LED on the front of my 828mkII says 48 kHz. All good.

Now, start Finale.

In MOTU Audio Setup, the Sample Rate changes from 48000 to 44100. Also on the 828mkII's front panel. In Digital Performer, however, both in the popup menu and in Configure Hardware Driver, it still reads 48000.

Now what apparently happens is that anything you record from now on is recorded at 44.1 kHz, anything you play back is played at 44.1 kHz (so you don't notice anything wrong while tracking or listening), but DP thinks the new soundbites are 48 kHz and tags them as such.

You can quit Finale if you like, it doesn't fix the problem. If you quit DP and start it again, the problem is fixed. But every audio file you recorded during the mismatch is actually at 44.1, but DP has it tagged at 48, so now it plays at a higher pitch. You need to go through the hoops I describe above to fix it.

LESSON: If you need to open a Finale file, quit Digital Performer first. Then quit Finale when starting Digital Performer. And I'd recommend when starting DP again, check the sample rate on the hardware interface and Audio Setup before proceeding.

[stubbsonic]

Is there a setting in Finale that you could change to 48K?

[guitardood]

I had a similar problem when opening Melodyne from within DP. Somehow DP loses track of the hardware rate when another app changes it.

[MIDI Life Crisis]

Back in 2013...

http://www.motunation.com/forum/viewtop ... da#p466542