MOTU Audio Driver 1.6.59644 Creates Analog 7-8 Problem

[Babz]

This should be filed under violation of the "let sleeping dogs lie" principle ...

While trying to troubleshoot another issue, I decided to update my 828mk3 audio driver to the latest update, posted Jan. 20, 2014.

Now, every time I open an existing project, all of my track outputs get automatically reassigned to "Analog 7-8" (instead of Main Out 1-2, which is/was my default output). All of my input assignments were screwed up as well, including strangely-named inputs and buses.

It seems the update hosed my default output assignment in MOTU Audio Setup. When I opened old DP projects, my Bundles were screwed up, and simply opening an old project without saving changes would cause all the output assignments to STAY messed up.

After over and hour on the phone with MOTU tech support, and lots of trashing preferences, etc., I think the problem is finally solved. Unfortunately, not before a couple of important projects were messed up by this issue, and I had to reassign inputs and outputs one-by-one for over 100 tracks in one project in order to salvage it. (Reassigning them all with the Audio Assignments command would cause a crash.)

In short, W T F?

Has anyone ever seen anything like this?

Babz

[Shooshie]

Babz, I can't say I've seen exactly that, but I found my monitoring settings all changed up. I know they aren't as I left them, because I didn't have monitoring devices on some of those channels. I was able to go into CueMix and change it all back to the way I wanted it, and all was well. But the fact that I had to was a bit of a surprise. I don't remember now what channels they were assigned to, but they might have been Analog 7-8. That pair went to a half-broken pair of Yamaha SPX90-II's which I haven't used in at least 8 years, so that may well have been where they went. This was a 1296, which has 12 channels.

So what did you do to fix it? I had gone into Audio/MIDI Setup, PCI Audio, and other things before I realized I could fix it in CueMix. Were we dealing with the same problem?

[edit] Apparently not, as I reread your post. But now that I reread it, more is coming back to me from that first time I set up a new file with the new drivers. Indeed, I had a mess in the Bundles page. I ended up deleting channels and recreating them, assigning some by option-clicking the matrix in the Bundles page.

I never stopped to wonder whether this was some universal problem, but figured it was something I accidentally did before the last time I put things away.

Shooshie

[Babz]

What apparently happened was that installing the driver update (which I only did just to be up-to-date, not because I needed it) somehow reset my Default Stereo Output assignment to Analog 7-8 (which has nothing plugged into it; I've never even used it). The problem was, every time I would open a project after this, it would reset all my outputs to 7-8. I would watch it happen before my eyes. The project would open with all assigned to Main Out 1-2, then, in a flash, right after the project finished opening they would all change to 7-8. Spooky. The problem was that even if you closed without saving changes, the Bundles would be permanently reset to 7-8.

MOTU tech support has no explanation for why this happened, but they told me to check the Default Assignment in MOTU Audio Setup, and sure enough, it has been changed to 7-8 there. Once I changed it back to 1-2, subsequently opened projects were OK. But, unfortunately, any that had been opened before, were permanently changed and could only be fixed by deleting all bundles and reassigning them.

I also had to delete all my DP preferences (other issues going on, crashes, etc.) and now I'm in the process of recreating my New Template and Key Bindings, etc.

Weird stuff. Thought I would warn people and see if anyone else encountered anything weird with this driver update. Should have just stuck with the "if it ain't broke" maxim, but ....

If you DO try this update, I would advise people to open MOTU Audio Setup and check your default output assignment, before opening any DP projects. I will now make this a part of my standard routine whenever I update the audio driver in the future.

Babz

[Shooshie]

That IS weird! I don't remember if that's what happened to me or not. I just know that I could not mute the tracks I was recording. I was monitoring everything whether or not I wanted to be, and I was afraid of a feedback loop forming. Fortunately I caught it and shut off the monitors before the loop got formed. (I have a panic switch handy that shuts off all monitors in the room, regardless of whether they are currently in line for output) That had NEVER happened before. I was getting my story mixed up before. What I had described before was part of the problem, but the first problem was this monitoring of tracks, regardless of what I did in DP. That alone was weird enough for me, and has never happened. I soon realized that it could only be happening in CueMix, since DP was out of the loop; it didn't matter what I did in DP, the monitor continued, so I found the problem in CueMix after much searching, and fixed it. How on earth that got like that I'll never know.

It was after that, that I discovered that my output tracks were also screwed up. By the time I got everything back together, I had literally visited every app, page and dialog associated with audio setup. Now I wish I'd paid more attention to what I did and what IT did. Sounds like there is something screwy going on with this new driver update.

Shooshie

[Agent of Random]

That doesn't really add up because default stereo output in audio setup only affects system output apps like iTunes, it has zero bearing on your track assignments in DP. you can test that by changing the default output to something like 5-6, and then seeing if it also changes in DP (I bet it won't).

In DP the bundle order in the bundles window is more likely what got messed up...like if you used to have the main outs listed first but 7-8 got listed first instead, that would cause what you describe.

Why that would happen tho is beyond me!

[James Steele]

I've had weirdness happening though with correct system outputs as well as Audio Hijack not seeing DP's output. I'm going to try reverting to an earlier driver.

[Babz]

That doesn't really add up because default stereo output in audio setup only affects system output apps like iTunes, it has zero bearing on your track assignments in DP.

Just to be sure we're on the same page. I am talking about the Default Stereo Output setting in the MOTU Audio Setup app (the configuration software for my 828mk3), not some audio output setting in Mac OS System Preferences.

What happened in my case was that my DP projects had only one stereo output bundle, Main 1-2. (On the 828mk3, Main Out 1-2 is not the same as Analog Out 1-2, BTW, FYI.) Somehow the new driver changed my Default Stereo Output setting in the MOTU Audio Setup app to Analog 7-8 (which had never before been used in any project) and this created a new Analog 7-8 bundle at the top of my list in any DP project as soon as I opened it. And this took over all my output assignments.

MOTU calls the driver the "Universal Audio Installer", and it is intended to be an installer for the whole line of DP audio interfaces. My guess is the reason for the update (released mid-Jan 2014) mostly had to do with the new 828x product. Perhaps this new product's outputs are slightly different than the older 828mk3 I have, and the new driver fails to take into account this difference. Just a guess. Would be curious if my issue is an isolated incident or if other 828 users experience anything similar.

It may also be that this issue only affects users like me who use Main Out 1-2 as the default stereo output, and that users who use Analog 1-2 are not affected.

[Note: On the 828mk3 Main Out 1-2 is the stereo headphone out on the front of the unit, while Analog 1-2 are the Main XLR outs on the back. The Main Out 1-2 can mirror Analog 1-2, or it can be independent. When I first got the 828mk3, I had to create a Bundle in DP for Main Out 1-2 and drag it to the top so that newly created tracks would choose this output by default instead of Analog 1-2. This may sound more complicated than it is, but it also may be a key part of why I was affected by this issue, because I use the Main Out 1-2 independent of Analog 1-2. And by default DP puts Analog 1-2 at the top of the Bundles list.]

Again, you can safely update to the new driver, just be sure to check your default Stereo Output setting in the MOTU Audio Setup app before launching any DP projects.

Best,
Babz

[Tonio]

The read me shows that a fix was made last year, so I suppose the latest iteration broke the previous fix?


Enhancements introduced in version 1.6.57625 (6/13/2013):
• Aux 1-2 is now the first output stream on MicroBook II.
• Fixed an issue where default output assignment would reset after the computer restarts. • Fixed an issue where a MIDI Device would be duplicated after the computer restarts.

[Babz]

CHAPTER TWO: CueMix

Well, I thought this problem was just an anomaly, and thought I had resolved it by changing my Default Stereo Out from Analog 7-8 back to Main Out 1-2 ... until I check my CueMix FX settings.

I noticed that mix out in CueMix was set to Analog 7-8, even though it should have said Main Out 1-2, which is what I use to monitor. I changed it back to Main Out 1-2 and suddenly no sound!

Next, I noticed that the popup menu in CueMix where you assign outputs was messed up. Analog 7-8 was at the top, and there was no way to change it. The list is supposed to look like this:

Main Out 1-2
Analog 1-2
Analog 3-4
Analog 5-6
Analog 7-8
S/PDIF 1-2
Phones 1-2
ADAT A 1-2
ADAT A 3-4
ADAT A 5-6
ADAT A 7-8
ADAT B 1-2
ADAT B 3-4
ADAT B 5-6
ADAT B 7-8

BUT instead it looked like this:

Analog 7-8
Main Out 1-2
Analog 1-2
Analog 3-4
Analog 5-6
S/PDIF 1-2
Phones 1-2
ADAT A 1-2
ADAT A 3-4
ADAT A 5-6
ADAT A 7-8
ADAT B 1-2
ADAT B 3-4
ADAT B 5-6
ADAT B 7-8

Analog 7-8 was at the top, out of order in the list, and there was no way to change it.

Even stranger, I then noticed that when I had the Mix output set Main 1-2, the front panel would read:

MIX 1 ASSIGN
MASTER AN 3-4

Instead of:

MIX 1 ASSIGN
MASTER MAIN

I then discovered that as I changed output assignments in Cuemix, the front panel would be offset by one. For example, if I chose Analog 1-2, front panel would say 3-4; if I chose 3-4, front panel would say 5-6, and so forth.

I contacted MOTU Tech Support and they suggested that I reset my hardware unit, which is an 828mk3, which I did, but it did not fix the problem.

Then I tried redownloading and installing the 1.6.59644 Universal Audio Driver again, but that did not fix it.

Finally, I had to download and install the previous driver (v1.6.59200), and that fixed it.

So, I have to conclude that there is definitely something seriously wrong with this latest driver, at least if you are using an 828mk3.

I will call back MOTU tomorrow and see what they say. In the meantime, has anyone else had issues with this driver?

My set up is:

OS 10.8.5 (latest Mountain Lion)
828mk3 (not the hybrid model), latest firmware 1.06


Best,
Babz

[Babz]

OK, spoke to MOTU this morning. They have acknowledged the issue and are working on a fix and should have an update ready soon. They said this is an 828-specific issue, affects original and hybrid 828s (forgot to ask about the 828x).

So, for the time being, if you are an 828 user, I would recommend avoiding the v1.6.59644 | Jan. 20, 2014 Universal Audio Installer and waiting for the update, which, based on past experience with MOTU, could come quickly.

Driver updates are supposed to FIX problems, not cause them, so it is unfortunate when this happens. MOTU has an ever growing list of devices that they have to support with a single driver, so it is understandable that one device might slip through the cracks. But I'm sure MOTU works hard to avoid these things and deeply regrets when they happen, and it's good to know that they are now working on a fix!

It is a real pleasure to deal with MOTU tech support these days.

Best,
Babz

[Kubi]

Just FYI, new driver out, v1.6.60625

I was re-reading this before updating to the 1.6.59644, to decide whether or not I should do this - but of course am going to install the new one now.