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Things I'd Like To See: (Sorry if this is repetitive)

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Things I'd Like To See: (Sorry if this is repetitive)

Postby Asensory » Fri Jul 14, 2017 2:13 pm

I don't see a thread devoted to features and improvements users would like to have in an upcoming version of DP. I see a bugs and issues thread, but not a requests/improvements thread. So I'm posting some stuff I think would be cool. No doubt most of these wishes are not original to me, but as I said I don't see a consolidated thread of this kind.

Piano Roll- the piano roll is quite small, the lines representing MIDI data are super thin and hard to see/read. It would be nice to see a thicker bar, something easier to see and edit in detail.

Loops- An edit/change loops option. Highlight the loop and this would bring up a box with options to change the loop settings, just like the Insert Loops box has now.

Loops- Graphic Editing, I would love to be able to grab the tail end of a loop, in either the Sequence window or Tracks overview, and drag it to the desired length. The gray bar would snap in place as I drag the reticle, editing the loop length along the way.

Newer/Better VIs. I know, we all know this, but it should be said. MOTU needs to upgrade the VIs to be competitive with other DAWs. Wouldn't it be nice if Mach Five came with DP, like Alchemy now does in Logic? And Logis is a fraction of the price. (I know why that is, Apple gets to sell you a MAC in order to use it and so gain a captive customer). Hell, MOTU could make a version of DP with and without certain VIs, for a difference in price and upgrade pricing available later should you change your mind.

Clip Launching. Yeah yeah yeah, I know, why do it when Logic Pro for iOS and of course Ableton do it so well. Well, maybe because I don't want to have to LEARN another DAW, and maybe I like DP but just want that option so as to explore additional creative methods, and the live/stage application it would have.

Highlight last added- One click, somewhere convenient, an icon, something, that highlights the last audio or MIDI I entered. This would facilitate quantizing or other processes without having to go back and do it manually. I'm lazy, and I ain't ashamed to say it.

Modern FX - Electronic guys like me like all kinds of cool fx like "granular delays" and "beat repeaters / retriggererserersss but DP has none of that stuff. Let's have more creative FX tools, ALONG with the necessary mastering and mixing tools. This would be another reason to not want to check out Ableton. Note I didn't say "good fx," I'm not complaining about what's there, just requesting some stuff that's not there.
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Re: Things I'd Like To See: (Sorry if this is repetitive)

Postby James Steele » Fri Jul 14, 2017 6:55 pm

Apple doesn't need to make a profit on Logic. I'd bet they don't. When you sell gobs of iPhones and various computer devices, you can pile on features and instruments and then charge an artificially low price for it. That's a tough ecosystem to compete in. Might be why MOTU makes a Windows version of DP now.

I have a very visceral concern as to whether it's even wise to try and make a DAW that can be all things to all users. Figure out what DAW fits your particular workflow and go with that.
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Re: Things I'd Like To See: (Sorry if this is repetitive)

Postby laurof » Fri Jul 14, 2017 11:51 pm

Hi,
It would be really appreciate a new redisegned mixer with better metering and resizable channels

Thank you

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Re: Things I'd Like To See: (Sorry if this is repetitive)

Postby mikehalloran » Sat Jul 15, 2017 4:52 am

James Steele wrote:Apple doesn't need to make a profit on Logic. I'd bet they don't...

To expand on that point. Logic, like iWork (Pages et all) and other Apple apps exist for one purpose only: to sell more Macs. Period. Heck, iWork and iLife apps are now free. The Pro Apps bundle was dropped to $199 a few months ago in the education store but the requirements are so loose nowadays it's hard not to qualify.

Like other serious users, i howled at the moon (and to every Apple employee I know) as iWork and others have been dumbed down over the years to be compatible with iOS. I get it now—those apps are now built for anyone to have basic features and they work the same on your Mac and iOS. I use them to work on my iPad and open them on my Mac where I import docs into Word. I embrace the convenience even if I'm limited in what I can do.

It's MacWrite and MacPaint all over again. Hello.

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Re: Things I'd Like To See: (Sorry if this is repetitive)

Postby stubbsonic » Sat Jul 15, 2017 9:32 am

Re: Piano Roll, you can zoom horizontally and vertically. There is a little "ramp" looking pop-up on the left that can make the notes as huge as anyone could ever want or need.
However, there are quite a few GUI elements that are too small, (not the piano roll, but the V's for velocity, the T's for tempo, etc. etc. It has been discussed VERY OFTEN on this forum.

Re: Loops, there are ways to change all the options of the loop from within any of the editors, just like selecting notes.

Re: Loops Graphic Editing, you can move the loop's front and end around in the graphic editor, up in the top part of the window.

Re: Newer/Better VIs. Many of us agree that including MachFive with DP would be a huge value added. But I'm sure MOTU has their reasons to keep things as they are.

I don't know what Clip Launching is.

Highlight last added- This is a fantastic idea-- to have a little key-combo that selects the last added audio or MIDI.

Modern FX - Electronic guys like me like all kinds of cool fx like "granular delays" and "beat repeaters / retriggererserersss but DP has none of that stuff. Let's have more creative FX tools, ALONG with the necessary mastering and mixing tools. This would be another reason to not want to check out Ableton. Note I didn't say "good fx," I'm not complaining about what's there, just requesting some stuff that's not there.[/quote]

That's a fair point. Which FX are considered to be "basic effects"?, and which are more "genre specific". Because DP can host VST & AUs, you can really install the set that works best for your needs. Seems like the granular delays and retrigger stuff could be folded into a single "Temporal Manipulation" plugin.
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Re: Things I'd Like To See: (Sorry if this is repetitive)

Postby Tritonemusic » Sun Jul 16, 2017 11:06 am

stubbsonic wrote:Highlight last added- This is a fantastic idea-- to have a little key-combo that selects the last added audio or MIDI.


This is not the same thing, but it seems like a good opportunity for me to mention it. I'd like an option, perhaps named something like "Recall Last Selection." I can't tell you how many times I've toiled at making a precise selection, only to find myself losing it completely because of hitting some random key, due to pilot-error.

Is there a way to recall your last selection after accidentally deselecting? Audio or MIDI?
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Re: Things I'd Like To See: (Sorry if this is repetitive)

Postby stubbsonic » Sun Jul 16, 2017 9:07 pm

Tritonemusic wrote:This is not the same thing, but it seems like a good opportunity for me to mention it. I'd like an option, perhaps named something like "Recall Last Selection." I can't tell you how many times I've toiled at making a precise selection, only to find myself losing it completely because of hitting some random key, due to pilot-error.

Is there a way to recall your last selection after accidentally deselecting? Audio or MIDI?


HELL YEA! How many times I'm going through and shift-clicking on a bunch of specific notes, and I accidentally lift up on shift. Oop. Start over. Yea, that would be handy. So if DP keeps track that you've just had a selection, then did something to change what was selected, it's like we want an UNDO function that is specific to the selection tasks that are happening.
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Re: Things I'd Like To See: (Sorry if this is repetitive)

Postby Asensory » Mon Jul 17, 2017 10:05 am

I definitely get the point about Logic, that is what I figured the deal was. They have to sell you the mac, and a bunch of software for it along with Logic, so making money on that DAW is the goal.

I like the idea of having a "recall last selected" as well. It goes well with auto-select last added feature. Regarding FX, VIs, etc. of course I along with everyone else have turned to the open market and found some great options out there. Its literally endless ... more and more plugins become available everyday it seems.

Stubbsonic - clip launching is what Live, and now garage Band for iOS does. A "clip" is just another word for a loop, but it doesn't have to repeat, it can play once or repeat a certain number of times. You define a few bars as either a MIDI or Audio clip, then trigger it along with other clips you have in your arrangement. The screen looks like a calendar or something. Adjacent tracks can play with each other, multiple clips on the same track are arranged vertically and play one at a time. Your performance is how a when you trigger groups of clips, and gets recorded into a standard tracks view, like what DP has. That tracks view is a different page in the DAW.
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Re: Things I'd Like To See: (Sorry if this is repetitive)

Postby Gravity Jim » Mon Jul 17, 2017 11:16 am

James Steele wrote:I have a very visceral concern as to whether it's even wise to try and make a DAW that can be all things to all users. Figure out what DAW fits your particular workflow and go with that.


Right on. Every time I read a post on this forum that says, "Hey, DP doesn't do what I want the way Logic/Cubase/ProTools/whatever does," I want to say (and have), "Well, then, why don't you use that other DAW?"
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Re: Things I'd Like To See: (Sorry if this is repetitive)

Postby Asensory » Mon Jul 17, 2017 1:32 pm

The answer is simple, DP does do many things, most things really well, we like it and don't want the hassle of having to learn another DAW unless absolutely necessary. Some things are just obvious, and could be improved relatively easily. As users, we know DP and have good suggestions to make. The users that don't like DP at all, or don't know about it are already using those other DAWs.
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Re: Things I'd Like To See: (Sorry if this is repetitive)

Postby lampfilmusic » Wed Jul 19, 2017 11:20 am

The notation facility in DP9 is really good. I love the way in which word syllables are automatically aligned to the next note.

Everything is there for making functional scores in DP, EXCEPT (oh dear, oh dear) PHRASE MARKS. Why oh why have MOTU excluded this? It would be so simple to implement and so useful.

Music does not really exist without phrases. A score without phrase marks looks naked and just plain wrong. Come on MOTU: add a phrase mark facility to your notation editor! Thanks in advance. :wink:
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Re: Things I'd Like To See: (Sorry if this is repetitive)

Postby Michael Canavan » Wed Jul 26, 2017 1:33 pm

I don't think any thread on feature requests should be without a request for a simple bounce setting that renders all tracks as audio files. Having to use the freeze function in DP is the work around, but it truly doesn't compare to a simple bounce setting, which both Live and Logic have.

If anything at all in the digital realm is a possible problem it's older projects with out of date or discontinued plug ins on a micro edited unrendered track. Studio crumgion Steve Albini states this is his reason for still recording to tape, which is a ridiculous reason, but anything that makes the process of archiving a song digitally easier is a good thing IMO.
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Re: Things I'd Like To See: (Sorry if this is repetitive)

Postby Shooshie » Thu Jul 27, 2017 9:18 am

Always, in threads like this, people request things that already exist, or that have other methods of doing the same thing, or they request more VIs and effects. The latter two are not the focus of a professional DAW. There's a world of them out there; just go find what you want and buy it. If you need for your DAW to be your one-price-fits-all toy box, buy Logic.

The "thicker bars" in the piano roll are accomplished via zoom. There are three ways to do it:
1) use the little vertical zoom thing in the upper left corner of the window, which looks a little like a windshield wiper, and is used for zooming the thickness of soundbite wave-forms, too.
2) Command-Up Arrow and Down Arrow — vertical zoom. Just like Command-Left Arrow and Right Arrow are for horizontal zoom.
3) Plus & Minus buttons in the vertical margin bar on the bottom-right corner. Likewise, the ones on the bottom margin bar will zoom the track horizontally.
Actually, there is a 4th and 5th way: use the zoom commands found in the Mini-Menu under Zoom. There are so many ways to zoom the tracks that it's almost surprising when people ask how to do it, for it's hard not to stumble onto it even without reading the manual.

-=-=-=-=-=-=-
The Loop suggestions are probably good ones. I use loops so seldom that I don't like to comment on that.
-=-=-=-=-=-=-
I would LOVE something that automatically remembers and restores your last selection. Almost any other thing is remembered through Undo.
-=-=-=-=-=-=- Save your range selections
If you KNOW you want to remember your current range selection, you can save it. (this is an existing feature, and has been for years) The command is in a drop-down menu in the Selection area of the top margin of the editor windows.

[edit]
This post originally was way longer. I got very far off topic posting some tips that I thought less experienced users could try for getting a lot more out of DP, a lot faster. The post inspired me to rewrite it for the Tips Sheet, so I did, and it's now a much better post than the one I wrote here, so I'm deleting the parts of this post that are not related to the OP's questions or comments. Go to the Tips Sheet, page 11 for the "Turbo Tips" that were originally here.


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Re: Things I'd Like To See: (Sorry if this is repetitive)

Postby cleamon » Thu Jul 27, 2017 12:45 pm

James Steele wrote:Apple doesn't need to make a profit on Logic. I'd bet they don't. When you sell gobs of iPhones and various computer devices, you can pile on features and instruments and then charge an artificially low price for it. That's a tough ecosystem to compete in. Might be why MOTU makes a Windows version of DP now.

I have a very visceral concern as to whether it's even wise to try and make a DAW that can be all things to all users. Figure out what DAW fits your particular workflow and go with that.

Just being a devil's advocate here, but even if there are only 250k Logic licenses (and I think that's low), at $200 a pop, that's 50 million $$. They may not NEED to make money, but they surely are.
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Re: Things I'd Like To See: (Sorry if this is repetitive)

Postby Shooshie » Thu Jul 27, 2017 1:15 pm

Just a note: I just added a post in the Tips Sheet, based on my post above this one, which I'm calling "Turbo Tips."
Tips Sheet: Turbo Tips
If you all already use all these, then forgive my redundancy. I suspect, though, that a lot of newer users would find DP a lot more interesting if they were using these tips.

Enjoy...

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